Sign On
Create Account


single6-Dec-2003healthLoriJanine by votes73858.7%


Have you ever had the chicken pox?

2I don't know.

posted 7-Dec-2003 7:41pm  
I don't think so. I know I had the measles when I was a little kid.
posted 7-Dec-2003 7:52pm  
Yes, I had it in 4th grade, when I was 9.
posted 7-Dec-2003 7:58pm  
Yes! I had all the standard childhood diseases: chicken pox, the rolfs, mumps, impetigo, measles, qualms, the pneumatic plague...
posted 7-Dec-2003 8:05pm  
Yeah, 4 times.
Enheduanna Survey Central Subscriber
posted 7-Dec-2003 9:43pm  
posted 7-Dec-2003 9:54pm  
I believe I had the mumps as a child, but I don't remember ever having chicken pox.
posted 7-Dec-2003 10:26pm  
posted 7-Dec-2003 11:52pm  
I had chicken pox when I was 5 years old, just before I started Kindergarten, I think.
posted 7-Dec-2003 11:59pm  
Nope. One of my sons has and the other hasn't, even though at the time they slept in the same bed. How about that? Maybe someone should study us!
(reply to Zang) posted 8-Dec-2003 12:01am  
rolfs? qualms??
posted 8-Dec-2003 12:22am  
Yep. Don't remember when. My aunt didn't get them until she was like in her late teens, and they were twice as bad.

A little trivia- Tim Allen has never gotten the chicken pox.
posted 8-Dec-2003 1:06am  
Yes, I came down with the chicken pox on the first day of summer vacation after the third grade.
jettles Survey Central Subscriber
posted 8-Dec-2003 1:25am  
yes, at 6 or 7.
posted 8-Dec-2003 4:09am  
I think so
posted 8-Dec-2003 4:30am  
Yes, when I was younger. The worse was the cold camomile lotion to stop the damn itching.
Biggles Bronze Star Survey Creator
posted 8-Dec-2003 9:08am  
Yes, when I was nearly 4 I think. My younger brother was only just walking. I remember scratching a lot - I still have some scars.
(reply to CarolL) posted 8-Dec-2003 9:28am  
posted 8-Dec-2003 9:29am fact, I had it three times. The first two cases were very mild, but the last one was really bad. It was in my hair, on my palms, the soles of my mom said they were even in my mouth! Ewww!
posted 8-Dec-2003 10:00am  
and it drove me crazy. i kept scratching my back. and I couldn't go anywhere for what seemed like an eternity. I hate chicken pox.
posted 8-Dec-2003 10:08am  
Yes, I had them when I was 4 years old I think.
posted 8-Dec-2003 11:29am  
Yes, I was quite small & don't remember.
posted 8-Dec-2003 1:21pm  
Yes. I had them when I was 6 and in Kindergarten. I didn't feel sick at all. In fact, I wanted to go to school.
posted 8-Dec-2003 1:30pm  
Yes, years and years ago.
posted 8-Dec-2003 3:40pm  
yes.. when i was little -- me and my big brother got it at the same time!
posted 8-Dec-2003 4:09pm  
I think I did, I had some kind of pox, can't remember which ones.
(reply to Biggles) posted 8-Dec-2003 6:19pm  
Hi Claire..this chicken pox question got me thinking about our mini-discussion about vaccinations. I have a few links that you might be interested in (anti-vax advocates discussion), since I'm not yet as well versed on the subject as I'd like to be. Anyway, here's one:
The discussions are definitely biased ( is a website for a natural family living magazine) but I agree with a lot of what is being said I thought maybe we could talk about it if you're still interested in the topic. I know it's something that really makes you angry though, so I'll totally understand if you don't want to get into it. I hope you're feeling better soon. smiley:::smile
Biggles Bronze Star Survey Creator
posted 9-Dec-2003 5:43am  
Would you reply to me again, and I'll get onto it when I don't have flu?! Wish I'd had the flu vaccine!!!
posted 9-Dec-2003 1:21pm  
Yes, I had the chicken pox when I was in 2nd grade. I remembr being so miserable. I wanted to scratch so bad, but my parents watched me like a hawk the whole time. I'd try to sneak into my room and scratch.

My son hasn't had it. When he was going to daycare, several kids in his class got it, but he never did. He had the chicken pox vaccine, so I guess it worked!
(reply to Biggles) posted 9-Dec-2003 8:04pm  
I hope you get better quickly! Talk to you then.
posted 9-Dec-2003 9:10pm  
posted 11-Dec-2003 3:01am  
Yep, I was 7... end of first grade. I had perfect attendance up until then. I almost missed my first dance revue too. But I didn't, I danced. My brother came to the revue and I gave him the chicken pox. Neither he nor his girlfriend (now his wife) talked to me for about a month.
(reply to jettles) posted 13-Dec-2003 6:06pm  
Hi! I hear tell you got a new motorcycle. Fun! What did you get?
jettles Survey Central Subscriber
(reply to SueBee) posted 13-Dec-2003 11:11pm  
i bought a 2004 honda 1300 vtx retro.................... it is cool!!!!!!!!!
it's no harley of course, as mandy will tell you ............ but it is still COOOOL!!!!!!!
(reply to jettles) posted 16-Dec-2003 12:27am  
I just looked at a picture. Sweet! What color is yours? Do you ride it to work, or is it just for fun?

Harleys are awesome, but too damn expensive, and mostly too big for my short legs. I've always owned Hondas, so I'm rather partial to them, but I still have my eye on the Yamaha V-Star Custom.
(reply to jettles) posted 16-Dec-2003 9:52am  
I've been looking at those as a step-up from my Honda Shadow 600. My only concern is their weight; they're well over 600lbs as I recall.
jettles Survey Central Subscriber
(reply to SueBee) posted 17-Dec-2003 12:05am  
i ride it for pleasure mostly. i do ride it to work at times....... depending on the weather. the honda i have is the metallic silver.
the other motorcycle i was looking at was the v star 1100....... i have a v star 650 classic which i love.
jettles Survey Central Subscriber
(reply to dab) posted 17-Dec-2003 12:08am  
i was riding a yamaha v star 650 and was worried when i bought the honda 1300 vtx but it is so well balance that it is feels easier to ride than the 650 most of the time. i thought i would have trouble getting it home the first day but WOW it is an amazing ride. i probably weighs 100 lbs to 150lbs more than the 650 but you would never know it while riding or even at a stop.
(reply to jettles) posted 17-Dec-2003 9:47am  
One friend of a friend who has one said he's always very careful to park such that he doesn't have to back up because he's unable to push it backwards with his feet. I *was* impressed in the showroom at how well balanced it seemed. I figure the center of gravity must be very low. If you lay it down, can you pick it up?
posted 17-Dec-2003 5:46pm  
howdy my hippie friend!!
any word as to if you're expecting or not???

and i saw your comment about vaccines...noah hasn't had a single one, and i DO NOT intend to give him any, even if it means that i must homeschool or what not, sure i'm nervous about all of the man made viruses out there, and i'm sure that there are more to come, but i believe that vaccinations leads to antibiotics, just personal opinion though, not fact.....anyhow....if you're interested i can poke through my books and things for info on the subject, or if and when you are expecting smiley:::wink i can give you a name and email of a most wonderful lady who could answer all of your 'natural' questions, or if she couldn't she can lead you to a sourcesmiley:::smile
(reply to jettles) posted 18-Dec-2003 2:12am  
You have TWO motorcycles?! Something is wrong here... me with none... I must remedy this situation before long. I just looked at the 2004 V Stars and was happy to see they don't appear to have changed the design. I was afraid by the time I could afford one they wouldn't look as cool anymore.
(reply to dab) posted 18-Dec-2003 2:14am  
I had a black Shadow 500. I miss it. *sniff*
jettles Survey Central Subscriber
(reply to dab) posted 18-Dec-2003 7:38am  
hhhhmmm, i know i can pick it up with another person. i don't think i could pick it up by myself but then i don't think that most people with bikes larger than a 750 could pick them up by themselves.............. just my opinion and what i was told by a few people.
i can back it up easily because i have done it a few times.
jettles Survey Central Subscriber
(reply to SueBee) posted 18-Dec-2003 7:40am  
the 650 was the one my brother gave me so i had it shipped down here....... so i really only have paid for the new one!!
are you looking at the v star 1100 or 650?
two of the women that i ride with have v star 1100's and love them.
jettles Survey Central Subscriber
(reply to SueBee) posted 18-Dec-2003 7:41am  
by the way, i am getting the disease my brother has.................... he owns 5 motorcycles. he rides all year round. he lives in NJ.
(reply to jettles) posted 18-Dec-2003 10:44am  
I clearly need to go try one out. Just as clearly, not until next spring when the snow melts.
jettles Survey Central Subscriber
(reply to dab) posted 18-Dec-2003 4:51pm  
you clearly do!!! it is fun but you must be careful!!
(reply to jettles) posted 18-Dec-2003 10:25pm  
I'm looking at the 650. I think that's plenty powerful for my use, and I just want something as cheap as possible! I need a low seat for my short legs, too. I think the 1100 has a higher seat.

Um, doesn't it get pretty cold in NJ in the winter? It is a sickness! laughing out loud

Mandy's boyfriend has gloves that have a little squeegee on the thumb. I thought that was very clever!
(reply to jettles) posted 18-Dec-2003 10:35pm  
My boifriend took me for a ride on his Harley yesterday!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
OMIGOD!!!!!!!!!!!It was so amazing!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
You have never seen a gurl smile so much.....well...I would have smiled more If I was the one driving it...but alas...til my foot is better I am a passengersmiley:::smile
jettles Survey Central Subscriber
(reply to SueBee) posted 19-Dec-2003 8:15am  
the seat on the 1100 is not that much higher IF AT ALL. the seat on the honda 1300 is lower than the v star 1100!!!!!!! just wanted to mention that!
squeegee on the thumb? for?
jettles Survey Central Subscriber
(reply to mandy) posted 19-Dec-2003 8:15am  
YEP!!! it is amazing, passenger or driver!!!! what fun!!!
(reply to jettles) posted 19-Dec-2003 3:50pm  
Well, there's proof once again that I have a terrible memory. I guess it must have been just the price that was more appealing on the 650.

The squeegee on the thumb is for wiping raindrops off your face plate or goggles so you can see in the rain. Wiping it off with a gloved hand helps, but smears the water, so the squeegee seemed like a brilliant idea.
jettles Survey Central Subscriber
(reply to SueBee) posted 20-Dec-2003 5:51am  
yes it does..........
i think you should make a motorcycle purchase soon...............
(reply to LoriJanine) posted 20-Dec-2003 11:31am  
Da sickie pops!!
(reply to LindaH) posted 20-Dec-2003 3:11pm  
I was surprised Becca didn't get them from Danny. The whole time he was home sick, she was playing with him, climbing on him and stuff. Weird. I wonder if the less mild the case, the less contagious? *shrug*
(reply to LindaH) posted 21-Dec-2003 9:19am  
I spoke to soon. smiley:::frown
(reply to jettles) posted 21-Dec-2003 4:28pm  
Thank you for your vote of support. You can bet I'll be getting a bike just as soon as it's financially feasible. Too bad we live in opposite corners of the country and won't be able to ride together, but at least we can talk about it together! smiley:::smile
they Survey Central Subscriber Bronze Star Survey Creator
posted 29-Dec-2003 6:21pm  
I chose not to have my daughter vaccinated for chicken pox. She got them naturally, and got over it. I don't understand why anyone would willingly inject poison into their child like that for something that is rarely deadly in children. Also, the vaccine has not been around long enough for me to trust that there are no long term effects.

I went along with all the shots that are required by law, but I hated every minute of it. She was such a healthy baby, never got sick. The ONLY time she ever got sick is when they shot her up with vaccines. The MMR vaccine was particularly evil. She had a fever for a week! My doctor would give us a printout every time she got a new shot. It would list the chance of death and injury, the possible side effects, and the number to call to get government compensation if she died from it. Vaccinating my child is the scariest thing I've ever done.
(reply to they) posted 29-Dec-2003 6:56pm  
I definitely agree about the chicken pox. I also heard somewhere (haven't double checked) that the chicken pox vaccine is made from aborted fetal tissue, which is something I bet a lot of parents would care to know about. I'm not morally (ethically?) against abortion, but that does creep me out a little bit, and there have to be thousands of parents out there who are against abortion, and it seems like the information should be more out in the open. I have also heard of chicken pox parties, where parents take their kids to get the illness naturally so they'll be immune later. If all children get the shot, there won't be anyone to get natural immunity from!

Vaccinations are next on my list to really get down to reading about. Intuitively I'm against them, and I know that a lot of mothers that I'm on the same wavelength as, are against them as well. I just haven't read up as much as I'd like to yet. Got a while yet until the decision has to be made though.

I'm woefully unaware of laws regarding vaccinations also. What was Mary required to get? The whole idea of law-enforced vaccinations scares me a bit!
posted 29-Dec-2003 7:01pm  
Kids have to have certain vaccinations to be able to attend public schools. If you plan to home school or send your kids to some school that doesn't require them, there's no law that says they need them.
they Survey Central Subscriber Bronze Star Survey Creator
posted 29-Dec-2003 7:26pm  
There is no law that I am aware of that requires you to vaccinate your children except that the schools will not allow your child to attend without the required vaccinations. There may be some loophole, like religion.. I'm not sure.

I don't understand how the schools can require my daughter to have vaccinations when she is a danger to noone but herself, if everyone else has been vaccinated.

I can't remember all of them off the top of my head, I'd have to hunt down the shot records.. The ones that I remember are the MMR, IPV, DPT(I think)..
(reply to LindaH) posted 29-Dec-2003 7:46pm  
Ahh, okay! That's good to know.
(reply to they) posted 29-Dec-2003 7:49pm  
In case you're interested, this is the link I gave to Biggles--
I haven't read too much there yet, but it seems to be very informative, and you might find it interesting. At the least it's nice to know there are others out there who feel similar about this issue!

It is funny that people are so threatened by un-vaccinated children. If they have so much faith in the vaccinations, it shouldn't be an issue, right?
they Survey Central Subscriber Bronze Star Survey Creator
posted 29-Dec-2003 8:03pm  
I tried to read your site.. it was too scary to read. Maybe later smiley:::grin.
posted 29-Dec-2003 8:09pm  
smiley:::grin Okay. I know what you mean though. Difficult decisions.
(reply to they) posted 29-Dec-2003 8:09pm  
Oops, that last one was to you!
posted 5-Jan-2004 1:40pm  
yes twice
posted 13-Jan-2004 1:20am  
Biggles Bronze Star Survey Creator
posted 14-Jan-2004 5:08pm  
I finally get round to checking it out and the boards are closed for maintenance!!
Biggles Bronze Star Survey Creator
posted 14-Jan-2004 5:08pm  
(but I think there's a good chance you and I will disagree on this one - I really must read the rest of the comments on this survey about it)
Biggles Bronze Star Survey Creator
(reply to justjulie) posted 14-Jan-2004 5:16pm  
I've just made it to this survey, and I'm guessing it's fairly predictable that I'm going to have an opinion on this smiley:::smile

"and i saw your comment about vaccines...noah hasn't had a single one, and i DO NOT intend to give him any, even if it means that i must homeschool or what not,"

If you don't vaccinate him then you should definitely homeschool him and not allow him any contact with any babies or small children. Or any children really. Some children may have immunological disorders which mean they can't be vaccinated, or in some children the vaccination may just not have taken. If Noah is infected and is exposed to those children, they could die, even if Noah recovers well. And the lack of contact with other children will mean that he has reduced immunity to a whole host of infections that most children are largely immune to by their late-teens.

"sure i'm nervous about all of the man made viruses out there"

The what? Examples?

"but i believe that vaccinations leads to antibiotics"

Why on earth would they do that? Vaccinations stimulate immunity to certain viral infections. Antibiotics are a treatment for bacterial infections. How can one lead to the other?
Biggles Bronze Star Survey Creator
(reply to they) posted 14-Jan-2004 5:31pm  
"I chose not to have my daughter vaccinated for chicken pox. She got them naturally, and got over it. I don't understand why anyone would willingly inject poison into their child like that for something that is rarely deadly in children."

I'm not certain about this (never heard of chicken pox vaccination before) but it's quite possible that being vaccinated from chicken pox prevents people from getting shingles later in life.

Plus, if you get chickenpox as an adult, it's a really horrid thing - a lot of people are hospitalised with pneumonia. Better to have the vaccination than risk getting it as an adult. Of course, if you're sure your child will contract it while young then that isn't such a big issue, but why make your child suffer through it when they could just have an injection with a few side-effects, but no real risk and no scarring? (I still have a lot of scars from when I had chickenpox when I was 3 or 4).

"I went along with all the shots that are required by law, but I hated every minute of it. She was such a healthy baby, never got sick. The ONLY time she ever got sick is when they shot her up with vaccines. The MMR vaccine was particularly evil. She had a fever for a week!"

The MMR is quite new so I had it when it was first introduced. I was about 15. Most people it was fine for, but 2 of us in my class (of 30) had quite bad reactions. I had a big, solid disc on my arm where I'd had the jab and it was very hot and sore. I also had a temperature for about a week. Another lad had his whole upper arm swell up. But it was a minor inconvenience compared to getting Measles or Rubella (I had Mumps as a baby).
(reply to Biggles) posted 14-Jan-2004 5:36pm  
well one, the flu..HAS to be man made, or else why could it be possible for people to get flu shots every year and still get the flu..anitbiotics are man made and so are vaccinations, of course they go hand in hand, it's a vicious cycle, yes science is good and great and grand and i KNOW you don't or won't or could not agree w/ anything i say here, so i shall not bother to try to inflict my opinions upon you..
all i know is that noah has never been vaccicated and he's maybe had 2 colds in his 2 1/2 years of exisitence, and i'm glad he's had those colds for i believe that it's actually helping his own immune system and strengthing it, instead of relying upon vaccitions to make it strong...i mean c'mon claire, the chicken pox vaccine?!?!?!!!!! i had it and survived just like every other kid/adult i know...
we have a diffence of opinion and view and lets just leave it at that
Biggles Bronze Star Survey Creator
posted 14-Jan-2004 5:41pm  
"I have also heard of chicken pox parties, where parents take their kids to get the illness naturally so they'll be immune later. If all children get the shot, there won't be anyone to get natural immunity from!"

This idea of natural versus unnatural immunity is a strange one. There's no difference, the body produces the same antibodies and has the same kind of immunity regardless. If the children are all vaccinated, no-one will need to be exposed to the virus to become immune through that route! And they get to avoid the unpleasantness of having chickenpox, which I recall was thoroughly horrid.
Biggles Bronze Star Survey Creator
(reply to they) posted 14-Jan-2004 5:45pm  
"I don't understand how the schools can require my daughter to have vaccinations when she is a danger to noone but herself, if everyone else has been vaccinated."

Everyone else may not have been vaccinated. They may have an immunological disorder that means that they can't have the vaccination, or be allergic to one of the ingredients. But that shouldn't matter because as long as a great enough proportion of the general public is vaccinated (herd immunity), those exceptions are unlikely to come into contact with the virus. Not to mention younger siblings of other kids at the school who may not have been vaccinated yet, but come into contact with it via your unvaccinated child - kind of antisocial to kill off other people's children!
Biggles Bronze Star Survey Creator
posted 14-Jan-2004 5:49pm  
"It is funny that people are so threatened by un-vaccinated children. If they have so much faith in the vaccinations, it shouldn't be an issue, right?"

It's an issue of herd immunity. If a certain proportion of people are vaccinated, it prevents outbreaks from occurring. There are plenty of people who can't have vaccinations for medical reasons, and sometimes a vaccine just doesn't take. To protect those people, most of everyone else needs to be vaccinated. Just think, your child could be infected with measles and get over it ok, but that wouldn't mean that they couldn't have given it to a child who was vaccinated but who it didn't work for, and that child could then die. You shouldn't be allowed to endanger other peoples kids, and that's why the rules are in place. (And I sometimes think it's a pity that there aren't any laws in place to stop people from endangering their own children by refusing to vaccinate on the basis of bad science and hearsay.)
Biggles Bronze Star Survey Creator
(reply to justjulie) posted 14-Jan-2004 6:11pm  
"well one, the flu..HAS to be man made, or else why could it be possible for people to get flu shots every year and still get the flu"

That's a man-made *vaccine* not a man-made virus. The vaccine can't give anyone the disease. True enough it's based on a virus, but influenza vaccines are "killed" vaccines.

"..anitbiotics are man made and so are vaccinations, of course they go hand in hand"

Well to start with, antibiotics are produced by fungi - just think of the story of the discovery of penicillin. We control their production so we can use them to treat bacterial infections, but they're present in nature anyway. And I still don't understand how vaccinations *lead* to antibiotics. Antibiotics were present in nature millions of years before anyone thought of vaccination. And even if they do somehow go "hand in hand", why is that a bad thing? Because they're man-made? So's that computer that you're sat at now!

"it's a vicious cycle"

What is?

"yes science is good and great and grand"


"and i KNOW you don't or won't or could not agree w/ anything i say here"

Won't is the wrong word I think. I don't, and I can't based on what I believe to be facts.

"all i know is that noah has never been vaccicated and he's maybe had 2 colds in his 2 1/2 years of exisitence, and i'm glad he's had those colds for i believe that it's actually helping his own immune system and strengthing it, instead of relying upon vaccitions to make it strong"

You can't cite a single case as evidence for a policy of not vaccinating. I agree that it's good that he's had those colds - it means he won't get them again. That's one of the main reasons we have fewer colds as adults than children - we've had a lot of them already. But this idea of "natural" immunity is a misguided one, as I was just commenting to glitterbits. Vaccinations don't give someone some kind of lesser or artificial immunity - they provide the same protection that would come if you were actually infected, except without you having to suffer the illness!

"...i mean c'mon claire, the chicken pox vaccine?!?!?!!!!! i had it and survived just like every other kid/adult i know... "

I had it and survived it too. But if I'd had it as a small baby, or as an adult I may not have been so lucky. And it's not a nice thing to have, so if you can easily protect your child from getting it, then why not? Especially if it protects them from getting it as an adult or getting shingles later in life. There are a couple of issues I'm unsure of relating to the chickenpox vaccine though, it depends how long immunity is maintained, how good it will be over a lifetime.

But even so, while chickenpox may not be the top of most people's worry list, there are plenty of other diseases that we can be vaccinated against that should be. If you don't vaccinate your child against anything then you are putting him and children that he interacts with at risk of serious illness, disability and even death.

And all because of what? A belief that 21st century science and technology *must* be bad?
they Survey Central Subscriber Bronze Star Survey Creator
(reply to Biggles) posted 14-Jan-2004 8:29pm  
I realize that chickenpox is a problem with adults. If it got to a point where we didn't think she'd ever get them, we could always have her vaccinated later.. but, it's not hard to catch the chickenpox.. like I said, she got them when she was 3 and she is hardly ever around other children(sucks, but true).. I never understood that about the scarring.. I have no scars from it, my SO doesn't, mary doesn't.. and I don't think anyone in my family has them.. cosmetic issues aren't enough to sway me anyway.

About the MMR.. since you had those symptoms, maybe you can understand what it would be like to see them in your infant as a first time parent. It was the scariest thing I've done as a parent. And I'm the one that held her down and made her have it done.

I'm sick and I don't really feel up to this smiley:::frown.. I'll be back later!
(reply to Biggles) posted 14-Jan-2004 8:49pm  
no offense claire, but really...go debate w/ someone else really......

you believe what you believe to be fact as shall i, and i'm telling you to leave it at that
cuz really, i don't care what you think on the subject and i don't care to butt heads about it, i've made my choice on the matter and i WILL indeed think what i want to think, and you can keep knocking on my door and play the part of the jehova's wittness, and i shall contiue to smile and nod and let you think what you want to to think, whether or not i consider what you think to be fact as so you claim
(reply to Biggles) posted 14-Jan-2004 9:02pm  
I haven't read as much as I'd like on the topic yet, so I wouldn't say that I have a very firm stance. But from the things I have read, I do naturally and instinctively lean towards delayed and minimal vaccinations. I'll have to learn more before I need to make any final decisions of course, but as it is right now, I'm in absolutely no position to debate you. I just thought you might like to take a look at the issue from another side, and the people at those boards are pretty well-versed in their beliefs.
Biggles Bronze Star Survey Creator
(reply to they) posted 15-Jan-2004 12:40pm  
I can appreciate that it must be frightening to see your child with a fever, but it would surely be worse if they actually had measles? I know that it involves putting trust in what doctors are saying, but surely that's possible?
Biggles Bronze Star Survey Creator
(reply to justjulie) posted 15-Jan-2004 1:11pm  
"No offense claire..." and then you proceed to be offensive. As though I raised this solely because I wanted to see my words on the page. I raised this, because I think you're misinformed and I think you're putting your child's life at risk, and every other child he comes into contact with. I *know* you're a good mother, it shines out of you whenever you talk about Noah and I'm sure that you really want to do what's best for him. And if you do, I'm pleading with you, please look again at the facts - get in touch with someone who really knows their stuff. Don't trust what a couple of kooky doctors say in book or on websites, don't trust the hearsay evidence from other mothers. Get in touch with someone from the WHO or the CDC, or the Red Cross or Medicine Without Frontiers if you want wholly non-governmental organisations. And then either trust them, or if you must believe the websites, and the mothers groups and the couple of kooky doctors, educate yourself in immunology, and epidemiology before you make your final decision. Because it's clear that you haven't been getting all of your information from reputable sources if you can say some of the things you have. Surely it's worth really making sure that the decision you make is the right one?

If after that, you still feel you have good reasons to reject all vaccinations, then I'll respect that. I'll still disagree (smiley:::wink) but I'll respect it. I don't respect your decision now, because I don't believe it's been made based on all of the evidence that is available.

I just think there are some things worth doing right.

And I'm sorry I can get narky about this topic, but it fills me with despair and a sense of helplessness. I want to grab people and shout "vaccinate, vaccinate" at them even though I'm sure that would do more harm than good smiley:::smile It upsets me how so many people think so little of science when it has given them so much. And the disease stuff is really my passion, it's my vocation and it's hard not to say anything when someone you care about is making statements that you wholly disagree with. Because however little you may regard my opinions as being worthy of your notice, I'm still interested in knowing what *you* think.
Biggles Bronze Star Survey Creator
posted 15-Jan-2004 1:28pm  
They still aren't up smiley:::frown but I've read the messageboards for "JABS" which is a British group for the parents of "vaccine-damaged children". Most of them are parents who believe that their child is autistic because of the MMR. The evidence for it is appalling, and much of the evidence that they quote is just ridiculous. "My son had the MMR and had a bit of a fever. Six months later he had another fever, after that he'd regressed and was diagnosed as autistic." Six months later? And they automatically blame the MMR? How about the fact that autism usually manifests itself about 6 months after the age when the MMR is usually given?

The level of silliness on the JABS board is very high too - with people asking for recommendations for homeopaths, and even more ridiculously, iridologists. I mean, if their science education is so poor that they believe that iridologists are actually able to diagnose exactly what's wrong with their child, and that they can be treated by ingesting water that at one point had a molecule of a medicine in it but is now just pure water, then how can other people be content to listen to them and believe everything that they're saying?

All of which is just by way of saying that I have seen boards similar to the way I imagine the one you've seen is. If I was you, I wouldn't put too much stock by them - don't scare yourself by reading them until you've got a good grasp of the facts, and then you'll be much more able to separate the rubbish from the stuff that is actually valid. Brush up on what the experts say first - you don't have to trust governmental organisations if that worries you. I'm sure the World Health Organisation and Red Cross amongst others have something to say about it. As will the consultants (top doctors) at your local hospital or disease specialists at your local university. And there are plenty of good books to read, not necessarily about vaccines in particular, but about immunity in general. If you have the idea that vaccinations lead to artificial immunity then you haven't read enough, so at least keep going until you can appreciate that immunity is immunity is immunity! smiley:::smile
(reply to Biggles) posted 15-Jan-2004 4:22pm  
good god...after this i beg you to drop it, for i know that you don't agree and i feel like this is a waste of energy, but first off, i do apologize for being offensive, was not my intention to be so, but i did not want to have this in saying that

frankly, i do not have faith in man, and going to a doctor for something questionable, is beyond my concept of what is and what isn't acceptable. you see, man has flaws, man has intent, man has ulterior motives, and i DO NOT trust doctors for one, and how can i possibly in good faoth just blindly accept what they are giving me as fact? i cannot and willnot. i also believe that drug companies & the governtment are in cohoots. so since docs are all about drugs, well most of them anyhow, how am i not to think that they aren't somehow involved w/ the government?
and what i meant by a vicious cycle is as follows, for i know how it works....i get vaccinated, all of a sudden i'm sick all of the time for whatever reason, but i'll get into that..anyhow..i go to the doc they do their little test, and in the mean time while they're waiting for test results, they perscribe antibiotics, for that is almost an obvious solution, whatever i've got, their antibiotics will fix.
ok, also, when one i vaccinated, it's much like taking, for example melatonin. melatonin is sold here in the states, it's a 'hormone' chemical whatever, to help you sleep. ok, you takt the melatonin, you sleep all is fine and dandy, until you stop taking the stuff, then you can't sleep. not becasue your body is dependent, but becasue your body STOPPED making that chemical because it was being replaced. mush like vaccinations, i believe that the body is already equipped w/ the means to heal it'self naturally.
i question about 'man made' illness as well, for like i said this IS indeed in the hands of man, so they can 'vaccinate' so they can also spread whatever it is their vaccinating for, meaning i go in to get my MMR, what they putting in me is MMR and 'god' only knows what else, so in doing so they HOPE that my body will then be 'programmed' to fight off MMR if i ever come in contact w/ any of the MMR in the future, it would be just less intense, but i know that the body can handle it.
basically this wstems from clarie, is that i do not have faith in man period, i believe there are too many different intents or ulterior motives involved in it all. think about this scenario, you go into a hospital or doc's office, a lady comes in wearing a name tag and in awhite coat, she's holding a cup and tells you to drink it, for she says that it'sa way to find out some info through your urine...a you drink it? can you really believe that that is what's in the cup? it could be anything, you don't know for sure, but you have to have FAITH in that this person is for real, but i don't, no way no how...
bnack to the govt thing, ok, anything i my opinion that deals w/ the govt can not be pure or 'good natured' maybe w/ those vaccinations there's a little memory chip in it somewhere, for how would you know otherwise, that is used for tracking purposes or etc..far fetched yes, but poossible, YES. how come i cannot go into any doc's office and ask to see my records? or my kids? all that stuff is off limits, why?
no, i'm not paranoid, which is what i'm sure you are thinking
and i must say in all honesty, if that it ran in my family or my husband family, that there were weak immune systems, then yeah i would consider it, but there is not at all

i'm glad that this is your passion, BUT....i have indeed made up my mind no matter what type of stats you can pull out of any source or etc etc, it seems to me that your passion would be best suited in an environment where disease runs rampid, like a 3rd world country or something of the like, i do wish you the best of luck w/in this journey of yours and i know that someday you can 'save the world', but..i myself am already savedsmiley:::wink
Biggles Bronze Star Survey Creator
(reply to justjulie) posted 16-Jan-2004 7:20am  
If you don't trust anyone but yourself, even to the slightest degree, then you *are* paranoid. If you are unwilling to read actual scientific textbooks and papers, which have been peer reviewed by countless other scientists, and think that it isn't just one big conspiracy to make you and your children ill, then I think that you're living in an imaginary world. If you believe that the US wouldn't be almost as over-run with preventable disease as a developing country if it wasn't for vaccinations and antibiotics then you're misguided. And people like you are part of a growing movement to turn the West into science and medicine-free zones. And that's just plain stupid. I have every right to be angry about this because you adding your voice to the anti-vaccination brigade puts *my* future children at risk. It puts *me* at risk.

And if you'll note, when you said you wouldn't debate it with me, I stopped debating - I just gave you some advice which you won't follow because you think that I'm part of a big conspiracy to harm your child. I'm not saying you have to agree with me - but I am saying you should have a reasonable grasp of the evidence for and against before you disagree.
(reply to Biggles) posted 16-Jan-2004 9:34am  
no no see i HAVE read books on the suject, in fact i'm looking over at my book shel as i type this and i see 3 books that i have INDEED READ on the subject of vaccinating...and frankly i just don't agree, voice isn't head throughout the land, i don't protest, this is simply a quiet personal decision that will not effect you or your future children, for i am one person, and frankly, i don't see how on little person in the sea of people can effect all others on such a grand scale. there are plenty and millions of other people in this land throughout the world, and who knows if they find a civilization on marssmiley:::wink, tons of folks to help...
and i know how i came off sounding but i think you failed to see the main point here that i am trying to make, and frankly it's all about spirituality, meaning as to where one places their FAITH. i CHOOSE not to place my faith in man for the reason i stated previously, not that i think that 'they're out to get me', but for the simple fact that man has flaws. so i CHOOSE to put my faith somewhere unknown, into the divine, i higher cosmic force, etc, for the simple reason that such an idea or energy feels pure and clean to me...
you see this is why i didn't want to have this discussion, for it's not all about what has or has not been printed, but this stems from a believe system that i have of my own, and i don't like to 'debate' 'religion' or gods or deities or whatever...for it's is indeed good to have faith, and frankly in my opinion it doesn't matter to me where one places their faith, as long as they have it, they could place it in man, in the cosmic force, or in swordfish, in the government, etc..doesn't matter to me personally, i will not argue w/ anyone who indeed has faith, and i *think* that your faith is placed in science and in man's evolutionary technology, and that is fine, your choice to place your faith wherever you desire, because it is faith

so, you see why i was reluctant to have this conversation, for it is indeed far more complex to me, than the simple 'facts', much more involved, and please don't think or assume for one second that i am misinformed, for that my friend is misinformation, or that i think that every person including you is out to harm my child, for that too is a false you m,ay proceed to draw your own conclusions about my views, but misinformation and paranoia do not make up part of this equation
(reply to Biggles) posted 16-Jan-2004 1:02pm  
I don't wish for any part of the world to be science or medicine free, but it does seem clear to me that science and medicine are often overused and overprescribed. Some things are only made more difficult and dangerous through the use of doctors' shiny new machines. I think that's where more and more people are coming from, yet you're seeing them as wanting science and medicine thrown out completely. Know what I mean?
There's a time and place for technology and science, just as there's a time and place for nature.
Biggles Bronze Star Survey Creator
posted 16-Jan-2004 4:23pm  
I'd agree with that certainly - just look where overuse of antibiotics has got us! But there is definitely a tide of people who really do hate all recent science and technology - they usually have a cut-off point that represents what they couldn't live without (like flushing toilets, or antibiotics when they have that respiratory infection) but forget how much science and technology is in their day-to-day lives when they rant and rave about it. People can be very rude when you say you're studying science at university smiley:::frown
(reply to Biggles) posted 16-Jan-2004 6:22pm  
That's very interesting to hear about, I've never really thought about it before. Science as something to be against, generally. Strange. I don't think I've come across that type of mindset, outside of my minimal reading about the lives of Amish people, but even that is very different from what I think you're saying. I'm having a difficult time wrapping my head around the issue!
(reply to Biggles) posted 16-Jan-2004 6:35pm  
I think science is one of the coolest things to be studying. I have wanted to open a science store. I'd invite you to visit if I did.

I also like drafting and architecture. I wonder if anyone else here is into that.
Biggles Bronze Star Survey Creator
posted 17-Jan-2004 11:46am  
That's because they look like regular people since they embrace using the things that they don't think of as science or technology! I don't get it really, but it's an interesting subject. I can sort of see where it's coming from - there was a time when doctors were thought of as gods with antibiotics and defeating smallpox, and that wasn't a good way to look at them, because they do make mistakes. But now we're getting the true backlash, and it's scary at times!
Biggles Bronze Star Survey Creator
(reply to LindaH) posted 17-Jan-2004 11:47am  
I love science stores, but I've not had the chnace to visit a really good one. Usually they're "education" stores that lean more towards the sciences. But they're good to wander round smiley:::smile
(reply to Biggles) posted 17-Jan-2004 3:54pm  
Hmm. I'll have to pay more attention.
posted 2-Aug-2006 10:06pm  
i hope i did when i was a baby!!! pleeze!
(reply to autumnlight) posted 2-Aug-2006 10:07pm  
i heard if u get it more than once u die but i guess im wrong
(reply to AlexelA) posted 8-Aug-2006 11:02am  
lol apparently.
paulyw Silver Star Survey Creator
posted 17-Oct-2017 10:37am  
Yes, in 9th grade. Good part was I didn't have to go to school for a whole week. Bad part was I had a ton of homework to do when I returned.
(reply to paulyw) posted 26-Oct-2017 3:19am  
Wow 9th grade. I believe I was in 3rd or 4th when I got them.

If you'd like to vote and/or comment on this survey, please Sign On

Link this survey:

Hits: 0 today (21 in the last 30 days)