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| Type | Created | Category | Creator | Sort | Votes | Hides | Rating | |
| single | 23-Apr-2001 | opinion | Kris13 | by votes | 71 | 16 | 53.1% |
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| User | Comment |
|---|---|
| kaleb777 | posted 23-Apr-2001 2:12pm I don't find them at all. These religions seem invisible. They have some temples near me, but they tend to keep to themselves and don't make much fuss at all. Maybe they are tolerant because they don't get involved with inter-religious issues. Maybe they're intolerant because they don't get involved with inter-religious issues. |
| dab | posted 23-Apr-2001 2:14pm I don't know that the greater acceptance is a result of the their polytheism, though that's an interesting theory. |
| jkiehart | posted 23-Apr-2001 2:16pm I would like to think so, but I can't say that I don't know enough about Buddhism and Hinduism to make an educated answer. It seems to me that polytheistic religions are less about controlling a group of people. Monotheistic religions are more about rules and control. |
| Maarten | posted 23-Apr-2001 2:22pm Nope, they all suck. |
| Enheduanna | posted 23-Apr-2001 3:58pm I wouldn't say they're more accepting of other beliefs per se; I think they're sometimes more accepting of the fact that people have different beliefs. |
| Jemmy | posted 23-Apr-2001 4:21pm I don't know enough about religion to answer. |
| lara | posted 23-Apr-2001 5:49pm I find this question inherently flawed, since Buddhism isn't necessarily theistic at all. |
| heyzeus1 | posted 23-Apr-2001 10:22pm Yup. |
| heyzeus1 | (reply to lara) posted 23-Apr-2001 10:24pm you don't consider enlightenment a theistic goal? |
| lara | (reply to heyzeus1) posted 23-Apr-2001 10:40pm hm. i never thought of it that way. interesting question. what do you think buddha would say? |
| heyzeus1 | (reply to lara) posted 23-Apr-2001 11:00pm he would probably tell us to meditate on the subject, and enlightenment will come |
| heyzeus1 | (reply to lara) posted 23-Apr-2001 11:01pm ...if youre lucky |
| natsim | posted 24-Apr-2001 12:27am I think both types of religions have both conservative and liberal followers, so I find it difficult to generalise. |
| Kristal_Rose | posted 24-Apr-2001 2:53am I find hinduism much more open minded at both the organizational level and personal; buddhists on the other hand seem to be less, but that may be a reflection of my own scrutiny of them. Hinduism (in the Spanda Karikas ) has the only model of reality I've found that explains all others. The christians I meet that have an immense depth of study and consciousness can relate to other vocabularies, but those who have a recent or no rapport with god can be a bit dogmatic. |
| Kristal_Rose | (reply to lara) posted 24-Apr-2001 2:56am Ultimately hinduism isn't really polytheistic either. |
| lara | (reply to Kristal_Rose) posted 24-Apr-2001 6:31am but it *is* theistic, isn't it? |
| lara | (reply to heyzeus1) posted 24-Apr-2001 6:34am i think you're right! i meditated on it, and i feel much better now (although i still wouldn't consider myself enlightened). lucky me. |
| juliw | posted 24-Apr-2001 5:42pm I don't know enough about these religions to say |
| Gamera | (reply to heyzeus1) posted 24-Apr-2001 11:03pm I don't really consider Buddhism theistic- I think of enlightenment as a non-theistic state of existence, and not really a "goal" per se, either. If you're striving for enlightenment, you're undermining your own exploration. |
| Gamera | (reply to Kristal_Rose) posted 24-Apr-2001 11:08pm I'm really curious that you've found buddhists to be more closed, that hasn't been my own experience, (I consider myself a buddhist and spend a fair amount of time with other buddhists and people considering that path) . I do know one or two very opinionated buddhists, but then again there are opinionated people everywhere. I only know one hindu personally and she and I have never talked about our respective spiritual beliefs on that level. |
| Kristal_Rose | (reply to Gamera) posted 25-Apr-2001 2:59am Most of the Buddhists I run into informally are great. My primary step-father was a baptist preacher who became a buddhist monk. But the last experience I had in quite a while formally was hanging out with a group of the Nichiren sect (Nam myo-Ho ren-Gyé Kyo) that concentrated on the 2nd, 14th, & 16th sutras. They considered every other sect evil enemies and other religions as hopelessly misinformed. Having ones wishes granted seemed to be their surface marketing. There were people there that experienced an understanding of some really high stuff. The energy was ultimately reminiscient of platinum shooting-stars in the void. Not for me at all. I don't even recall now just how, but I found that the sutra at a high level of understanding said much the same stuff as the trinity, the guna aspects of the spanda karikas, and the top triad of the kaballistic tree of life. Other Buddhists seem to have the most intense spectral energy I've met. There shakti is as pure and high frequency as a bell veering towards magnetism, though I have seen one able to sculpt nice airy colorful auras. So what is your experience? more below.. |
| Kristal_Rose | (reply to lara) posted 25-Apr-2001 3:49am It is monistic meaning basically there is one God substrate for all that is happening including thoughts and the appearance of matter. Abhinavesa is the term for our ignorance of this which seems to make a creation perceivable. Christianity tends to be dualistic at the popular level of interpretation, meaning God has become creator and creation, the latter of which contains us. Jesus was an exception to this rule. My guru quoted many great saints from Jesus to Buddha. She taught that they experienced the oneness of God as could we all. 'God dwells within you as you' and 'See god in each other' were the main paths to learn. They used every technique in the book but didn't lie about them being merely techniques. Bhakti yoga for instance is pure hearted devotion, particularly to your guru, but ultimately they teach it was God in you that created the intermediate step of having a guru appear on your behalf. A shakti-pat guru has the capacity to initiate a kundalini awakening. In my (not uncommon) case, it meant that within 3 weeks my mundane universe was conflicted with the appearance of several other dimensions of reality. It has taken me a decade to sort it all out. Other religions tend to have you rise the through the levels gradually instead of starting out at the top and going mad for awhile. I hear there is one group called the Spiritual Emergence Network that rescues people that have this awakening isolated from any background teaching from being locked away as schizophrenics. The closest I can explain the system is like a form of multiple existentialism. Since all dimensions are possible within that, the hindu pantheon can exist in much as the same fashion as jesus, but that primarily serves as model for own divinity, though I do see some of the original pantheon manifest occasionally. The spanda karikas is an ancient text on how our own thought return manifest about us. At one level it is much like the logos of western religion, the voice of god manifest in people and radios and birds and sirens. We personally mesh like clock gears with reality such that we have a personal synchronicity that speaks to our karma. High beings attract other experienced enlightened beings, mechanical consciousness tends to only encounter mechanical consciousness. I have found that although I am not God, God takes whatever form I believe god takes. At one time I believed in a wrathful God, and that was what I talked with and was subject to. Basically whatever I am ready to believe in comes true within a day or so. What I still do not yet know is how are these thoughts and desires of mine being created. I know they are a manifestation of God in timing with what I will experience in Gods creation. I have many surprises; I've been in realms where I was at the forefront of the whole script, seeing every detail of sound and speech in advance, even foreign languages I did not understand, but it wasn't very fun. When your mind is there with the creating, you can't react in delight. I take that back, I've done that too. I guess the only thing you can't do is perceive yourself as unique individual instead of the consciousness of the whole play. Still something akin to loneliness has me stay in a realm where it's me and other people, or me and god, and not 'I' alone. |
| micah | posted 25-Apr-2001 5:04am Yes, very much so. I'm always nastified by the whole 'I'm right you're wrong' thing. Shame, also, is a horrible thing, and most Christians tend to throw it around like Marti Gras beads. |
| Enheduanna | (reply to micah) posted 25-Apr-2001 9:42am But some Buddhist cultures, like Japan, have very strong honor-shame rules. Shame is a huge thing in Japan. |
| lara | (reply to Kristal_Rose) posted 25-Apr-2001 11:45am "I am he as you are he as you are me and we are all together." -The Beatles |
| TheBlackAdder | posted 25-Apr-2001 12:52pm The general focus of modern polytheistic religions is nothing, and often they focus on the nothing rather than anything at all, including good, godly thoughts. Christianity and Islam are different in that they call the worshipper to focus on God, His creation, and the power He has to change lives. By this simple fundamental difference, monotheistic, YHWH based, religions are more accepting in that they call the practitioner of the religion to be more than they started off being, rather than calling the practitioner to not only end this life and make as little difference as possible, but to live such a life so bereft of God, that the goal is to never live again, thus ending the cycle of life and achieving "Nirvana". |
| heyzeus1 | (reply to Gamera) posted 25-Apr-2001 6:02pm oh yeah, are you sure its not a non existing state of theism? |
| Kristal_Rose | (reply to lara) posted 25-Apr-2001 6:37pm Words are filling up like endless rain into a papercup. One thing I can tell you is you got to be free. |
| Kristal_Rose | (reply to TheBlackAdder) posted 25-Apr-2001 7:19pm Wow, a harsh criticism, possibly true depending upon what you mean. What sort of group are you referring to? Eastern, New-age, Pagan? You sound bitter like you ran into a Kali mandir group or something? Dissimilar yet comparable examples can be found in christianity as well. What about so many jehavahs witnesses and baptists and such bent on avoiding earthly pleasure while waiting for heaven. It can even be argued that christianity is evil in the way that it 's doctrine teaches that god and man are separate. I find it interesting that monotheism usually means dualism, while polytheism oftem means monism. I do agree that the thought that "we are one with the infinite control-flow yet our egos are too screwed up to see that" is more likely to produce suicide or lack of compassionate service than the concept that "myriad angelic and demonic forces are at work swaying people who need to correct god's lack of involvement in creation by doing service which might help make them candidates for selection into heaven, wheras suicide is punishable." It turns out however that suicide even in pure existentialism causes hell upon the seeker, and selfless karma turns out to be great concept for creating heaven. Only the flavor and vocabulary seem to differ. There are good and evil variants in all faiths. I think the acid tests for a faith are: will it get you closer to understanding the divine plan/self/creator, will it make gods creations a better places to live in, will it be eternal. This makes me at odds with nihilism including the void and armageddon, though ultimately even these would be subsets of a much greater reality in my book. All told, I find all religions and their adherants to be about equally qualitatively Mono/poly-theistic and monistic/dualistic, and equally likely to create internal and external heavens and hells, in spite of their different philosophys and doctrines at several levels of written, implied, and transcendentally experiential levels. I believe all paths are laden with pitfalls and lessons to be learned which will change ones initial understanding. Also, since I believe there is nothing here but God, ultimately all paths will lead back to God. In light of that, what works here and now is therefore more serious. Because of this, I can appreciate the well intended works of aethiests, though I would certainly prefer that these people were aware of powers they were unconsciously manifesting around them for better or worse. Nurturing people should become more empowered and rewarded to better carry out the work. Those with bad natures, I would prefer to have keep their karma to themselves until they learn from it. I would still like you to elaborate more on your comparative personal experience. |
| Gamera | (reply to heyzeus1) posted 26-Apr-2001 1:06am I'm not sure of anything. I'm just wandering down this path because it feels like a good path to be on. |
| micah | (reply to Enheduanna) posted 26-Apr-2001 4:53am Shame doesn't fit with Buddhism in my head for some reason. I just get the impression that Buddhism promotes understanding of the path of life, and that all the steps are acceptable. Don't they believe that life is a process and it's not better or worse to be at different stages of spiritual evolution? I seriously need to grab a book on that one. It's gonna bug the hell out of me. |
| Enheduanna | (reply to micah) posted 26-Apr-2001 9:45am No, I think you're right. That's one aspect of Buddhism. But there are lots of different kinds of Buddhism. I don't claim to remember all the specifics of all the varieties, but I do know they're not all like that. It really bugs me when Americans take all the aspects of Buddhism that they like, that are tolerant and peaceful and loving, and claim that that's Buddhism. It's like saying that Christianity is only about loving one's neighbor. Sure, some people practice it that way, but they're the minority. And generally speaking, there's much more too it than that. Buddhism has a lot of esoteric ritual and beliefs that intellectual Westerners choose to just gloss over in favor of the more philosophical aspects. There's nothing inherently wrong in taking certain aspects of a religion that you like and shaping them into your own belief system, just don't go claiming that it's Buddhism, because it's not. Or at least call it American Buddhism, to distinguish it from Zen or Mahayana or Theravada or Tibetan. Sorry, this is something I see a lot of and it really bugs me, and tends to send me off on rants. |
| micah | (reply to Enheduanna) posted 26-Apr-2001 1:51pm Well what I said was, as I said, just an impression I got. I haven't read much about that. Ma said I'm not too smart. |
| Enheduanna | (reply to micah) posted 26-Apr-2001 2:05pm Course you're smart! You're right that those are aspects of it. I was just going off on a rant, not directed specifically at you! |
| micah | (reply to Enheduanna) posted 26-Apr-2001 2:28pm You hate me! |
| Enheduanna | (reply to micah) posted 26-Apr-2001 3:23pm Uh huh. |
| Gamera | (reply to micah) posted 27-Apr-2001 1:16am As I understand it from my teachers, what you related is quite basic to Buddhism- that if you cannot accept where you are on your path, then you will encounter great difficulty trying to progress. If you are at all concerned about how others are progressing, then, still, you will have great difficulty paying attention to your own path. Shaming oneself or others would basically be seen as a pretty "unskillful" way to understand one's actions. Sure, there's a lot of shame in Japanese and Chinese cultures, which have had a lot of Buddhist influence on them, but Western cultures, with all their Christian influence have a lot of greed and idolatry which I think are pretty much not accepted as good Christian attributes (not that I know squat about Christianity, really). There are hundreds of different Buddhist traditions which put different emphasis on different aspects of the practice, but I think placing compassion on an equal level with wisdom in terms of importance and value is common to all Mahayana traditions, (practiced by the Japanese, Korean, and Chinese, and most Western schools). Even the Theravada, who believe that only the monks, and not the lay practitioners, can achieve enlightenment, would probably not judge the lay practitioners. The Vajrayana (such as the Tibetans) have a wicked complex esoteric practice, and the only person I've known to be into that was a North American who I'm sure carried a lot of baggage about wanting to have "secret knowledge" that "lesser people" didn't have- but I would attribute that to his personality rather than to Buddhism. |
| Gamera | (reply to micah) posted 27-Apr-2001 1:29am Hey, let's see, you get Mardi Gras beads for taking off your shirt in public ... |
| Kristal_Rose | (reply to Gamera) posted 27-Apr-2001 12:29pm I was just admiring a comment you made a couple years ago about giving up telekenisis to dance in the waterfalls. You were ahead of me on that one, though I don't consider my studies a waste. I'm glad to hear about Mahayana. My step-father was Zen. The nichiren considered mahayana the most evil, yet I found compassion curiously lacking amongst their priorities. On top of that, suspiciously, their meeting announcer always called at the most inopportune times like just after I'd fallen asleep or climbed in a bath. They also seemed to have layers of lies in their program, though I know many faiths have some level of esotericism. There was some good too, but then I have a knack for even finding that amongst murderers and dark pagan festivals. |
| Kristal_Rose | (reply to micah) posted 27-Apr-2001 12:37pm Topper's got some immense wisdom here, even if I'm delighted with Heyzeus's response (& toppers reply). It's all God. Even you. Ultimately you can't lose, but having a win-win path along the way makes it worthwhile. |
| Gamera | (reply to Kristal_Rose) posted 27-Apr-2001 7:16pm I had not read at all about the nichiren until you posted this. I looked them up and found that they are a sect that believes all other sects are wrong, they are the "True Buddhism," and they blamed the economic and political problems that Japan was having at the time on "false religious practices. " (13th century - also, roughly, when Christianity came to Japan, interestingly enough). The founder is described in Britannica as a "militant prophet." So much for acceptance. I guess the term "Buddhism" is too broad to make categorical statements such as the one this survey was based on. I don't know enough about the other religions listed to know if they, too, have such a huge range in them. Britannica, by the way, describes Shinto as polytheistic, but not Buddhism. |
| Gamera | (reply to Enheduanna) posted 27-Apr-2001 7:33pm Is Japan considered more of a Buddhist culture? or a Shinto culture? Both? Neither? Near as I can tell they both came to Japan around the same time, and Shinto has the most adherents. When did the shame stuff get so big in Japan? was it before or after Christianity came there? I really haven't studied Japanese culture much at all, but I'm a bit curious. |
| Enheduanna | (reply to Gamera) posted 28-Apr-2001 10:15am I think Shinto was there first. I'd say it's pretty well mixed with both, and it had occurred to me that the shame aspects of the culture could also be linked to Shinto. But the thing is that the honor-shame stuff stuck around after Buddhism got there as well. I think there are other Buddhist, as well as Hindu, cultures which have an honor-shame ethic--I believe China does, at least to some extent. And India, the home of Hinduism and the birthplace of Buddhism, for example, is also a highly stratified caste society (even now, when the caste system is supposedly illegal). Which indicates to me that Hinduism certainly isn't inherently tolerant either. |
| Enheduanna | (reply to Gamera) posted 28-Apr-2001 10:21am (I think the shame aspects of Japanese culture were there before Christianity got there. And Christianity hasn't taken hold in Japan the way it has in other places.) |
| cody | posted 28-Apr-2001 1:07pm Absolutely not. |
| Kristal_Rose | (reply to Gamera) posted 29-Apr-2001 5:41am My theory: Japanese shame is a much different beast. Although the gentlemans ethic existed in royal europe houses and templar knights and such, christianity came to japan aboard the machiavellian mercantilists ethic. Catholic guilt-shame was about feeling humility in general, where in japan it was more of an honor-disgrace tied in with representing your ancestors and such. It was called 'losing face' which implies more ones role than an internal distress. That sort of collective mind in which society is more important than the individual to an extent that one might commit hari-kari did not come from reformation or rennaissance europe mentality. Japan did not have the land mass to support banishment of outcasts. As to the nichiren buddhist group.. They do bear something in common with christians in that they are founded on an air of persecution, though rather than going for martyrdom, they seem to despise liberated aristocracy. Clinging to an identification with persecution doesn't seem too healthy to me. I think their disputes are more political than theosophical, much like protestants, anglicans, catholics, and such. On the other hand, since they seem to focus so much on personal worldly attainment, perhaps it is with good reason that they had a history of finding themselves in jails. They are still outlawed in asia I believe, also like the church of scientology is in parts of europe, again, for their very machiavellian stance. After learning so much wisdom through one of their teachers, I finally discovered just how satanic they are, although they share some of the same idealism that created hierarchies of angels. |
| Kristal_Rose | (reply to Enheduanna) posted 29-Apr-2001 5:52am We have a caste system in the US too, it's just not as transparent as one fortified by birth and geagraphy, and you are allowed to change caste if you can find a way. A great example of it is paying for education with local property taxes. Many people in wealthy neighborhoods are horrified by the thought that children of the ignorant poor might attend the schools that their tax dollars pay for. My landlord is at work gradually cleansing our building of the lower class element. I live just a block south of the 10 freeway in LA,CA,US. Sociologists claim very few people make it across that economic border. The border is even usually distinguishable by the billboards, in one direction it says 'SHOP', in the other it says 'GO TO JAIL'. worse, they seem to say 'die'. Most of the ads look like caskets, syringes, abortions, etc.' and in the other direction you have the Seinfeld cast saying "We've moved", and the poppin-fresh dough-boy advertising 'White'. My building here in the center of LA's bermuda triangle is tri-racial. |
| Enheduanna | (reply to Kristal_Rose) posted 29-Apr-2001 11:08am Oh, believe me, I wasn't trying to say that the US is any better. I was just arguing against romanticising. |
| TheBlackAdder | (reply to Kristal_Rose) posted 29-Apr-2001 2:29pm I don't speak of a personal experience, nor do I speak from an emotional standpoint, but rather from a logical analysis and in-depth study of the practice of various religions. Also, Jehovah’s Witnesses are not a Christian group, as defined as one that believes in the divinity of the man, Jesus Christ. Baptists are only Christian so far as the believe that Christ is divine, for they set aside many of the staple tenants of Christianity in an attempt to compensate for what seems to be an inability on the Bible's part to explain away the workings of God on Earth. But theology isn't the issue here. The cornerstone of all major religions is prayer and meditation. Whatever you interpret God to be is beside the point. The basic goal of prayer in Eastern and New Age meditation is to empty your mind, focusing on nothing at all, forcing away the good with the bad, where the goal of the Christian prayer is to fill your mind with thoughts of majesty, glory, and the power of God until "your heart is glad", and to ultimately know God better on a personal level. This very basic goal in prayer sees it's true ends in the goal of the religion in which it is practiced. Eastern and New Age religions proudly claim an end to the cycle of pain and life, graduating to exactly what, I don't know; Christianity proudly claiming the end result of a faithful life to be a life everlasting, given to the practitioner, solely by God, to live here, on an Earth remade by the hand of God, to abide here with God forever. I am not at all claiming that Christian spirituality, as can be observed by mainstream Christians, is in any way an example of what the Bible calls Christians to be. I firmly believe that most Christians have no idea what it is to pray and to know the will of God as expressed directly to them through His Holy Spirit. I feel very confident in saying this about the freaks you see on TV speaking as spokesman for a “religious right”, or some other politically motivated group, claiming they have the interests of mainstream Christians in mind when wielding there political might at any cause that seems moral and right. Surely it is true that the deep focus that Eastern, New Age, and Pagan religions have on spirituality and prayer might make them seem more open-minded and free, but under closer examination, monotheistic religions, such as Christianity, are the most open-minded, simply by the virtue of the relationship this type of religion calls it’s practitioner to have with God. |
| Kristal_Rose | (reply to TheBlackAdder) posted 30-Apr-2001 7:14am Transparent Let me exclaim the virtues of both sides of the same coin going in the same direction as far as the meditation goes. What you say is simultaneously true and false to some extent. I'l put an Eastern emphasis on it, as you have done for the western. I do commend you on what you're trying to do. The goal of emptying your mind has the same goals of knowing god better and making your heart glad (usually). Making complicated prayers creates complicated events in your life, and one might realize amongst all that diversity that their prayers have even been answered. When one has simpler meditations, for instance group praise, one might have a better chance at recognizing how god reflects that devotion. Clearing the mind has two purposes: removing the clutter so one can appreciate the divinity around them, whethar that be the presence of the holy ghost, or the smell of the roses; and stopping reality to the point that one discovers that their thoughts are one with the mind of god, and that as they start to have thoughts again, a similar reality surrounds them. Anyone with wisdom or common sense, once they realise the power of prayer in creating their reality, should only wish to create the most divine and joyous experience about them, ultimately leading a life that christianity would have them more ignorantly attempt from the start. My guru taught about 16 forms of yoga, some primary ones being bakti - love and devotion, seva - selfless service, kriya - burning away ignorance, and hatha - being good to the body. The spanda karikas is no different than the logos, although the bible doesn't try to explain any physics of that. The bible has unfortunately been watered down for public consumption by administrators. The jewish high priests had this knowledge in several texts that explained the physics of consciousness not too disimilarly from that also taught in eastern faiths today. The popes and anglican kings were choosy about what got published and what stayed in the scroll vaults (though I think JPII's a good guy). JP's learning and contributing to God's evolving story just like even the most advanced of beings in communication with God. As I said, eastern polytheistic isn't ultimately polytheistic, the goal taught is to find the one mind. Paganism might be, and satanicism certainly is, teaching to lean on any force, self separate from god, or satan, that is merely a subset, or as they would say, divorced from the creator. I don't know enough to really speak about buddhism. My (step)father was a baptist preacher who studied several faiths like hinduism before finally becoming a zen buddhist monk, and seemingly coming alive with with a fresh glowing zeal for life he had not shown earlier. That and the good vibes I get from some buddhists suggest to me that it must be a viable path too. Besides, I can't imagine god stranding the people of an entire continent for millenia. On the first night of my own awakening I had a strange experience. A week later I visited Guru Mayi's ashram in Oakland, and one of the monks I was hoping to ask, unprovoked, told me that I went to a place the buddhists call the void. It wasn't a place I'd want to return to other than to understand it better, but it did demarck my journey from one realm into the next. It was like seeing the light at the end of the tunnel without the light. Spirits wailed past me. At the same time, from the base of my spine came a golden aura sensation and I was in a state of blissful serenity, the thought was rolling through my head that I was dying and that it was nothing to worry about, by the time the aura crowned my head I would be gone, then my standard intellect consciousness started to kick in and I said "holy sh_t" and jumped out of bed to have a cigarette and calm my nerves. Every day got far more intense from there on out. Within two weeks I was developing all sorts of telepathic capabilities and similar things (which FYI, the yogi's tell you will happen after a kundalini awakening, but suggest you ignore such stuff and concentrate on love, service, and union with god (or your guru))That was in Dec. 1989. Another btw, Guru Mayi never said to follow her, she gave instructions on following ones guru, as she did hers. The books taught that others sages came to realise that god had created all their experiences for them, including the appearance of a teacher. I admit, I personally fell in love in love with her anyhow, as did everyone else there too I suppose. Within three weeks of my awakening however, I discovered the logos, and all that I learned about following one's guru was transferred to following the logos. You could call it wearing the yoke of christ even. This voice coaching me to attendance and worship in all sorts of forums, mostly christian churches, welcomed being called my guru, or jesus. (which, also btw, was one of the people, like buddha, my physical guru was fond of quoting). I did feel rather cheated when I had to end my love affair with the person, that she was only a lure to start me on my serious path. Unfortunately, my physical reality had dissolved to the point of disbelief, and I found it difficult to love anything for awhile. The rainbow weathar that followed me during devotional service to my guru in the form of kitchen work at 'intensives' left when i stopped having a physical target for my passion. The logos was guiding me at that time to forsake the physical for the purely spiritual, and I wanted my old ignorance back. To expediate the learning process i was wishing the rest of the physical world would go away. Renunciation of complicated material excess distraction had made my life a heaven at first, and so I pursued it further to every level of physical, emotional, and spiritual suicide possible. The logos explained the day after that it allowed me to do this (the most physically drastic suicide) because I just wouldn't believe it otherwise. That to kill myself was to kill the logos I spoke to. After this, I returned to doing the things I loved, for instance I wanted to do some service with my art abilities, asked for an opportunity, and a day later met someone who placed me on the guiding committee of a 1/4 mile long mural project to promote ocean environmental awareness. God works in many ways to suit the peculiarities of any seeker. Different faiths are always fighting about the right path, but I think god comes to anyone seeking god in any faith, and also suspect that anyone who has gone the distance on good path can see the virtues of another. On the other hand, God for me is like a wise informed travelling companion who let's me makes mistakes without warning me except when I'm about to make a serious mistake. I was congratulated, for instance when after I had some uniquely flavored mystical experiences through nichiren budhism (like plugging into a hive mind of ancestral spirit), that their was still no redeeming reason to continue with it, and I was congratulated on my decision. For all I know, the path has merit for others, or might at least be a stepping stone, but I found no love there in their practices. My personal path is to learn & teach (everything from art to consciousness), and do things I personally enjoy like buying antique relics or playing music, and turning them into opportunities for service when possible. I find that I like a balance of praying things into being by playing on a small physical scale. For instance, if I restore the yard at my apartment and speak publicly and with god about restoring rivers, I can expect to see news the next day about a group somewhere restoring a local river. Take delight in everything including yourself as gods creation is what works for me, and I believe is what all the decent faiths teach as well, after you navigate past all the distracting complications. |
| micah | (reply to Enheduanna) posted 1-May-2001 4:39am Do you still hate me? |
| Enheduanna | (reply to micah) posted 1-May-2001 9:03am As much as I ever did. |
| micah | (reply to Enheduanna) posted 2-May-2001 3:36am You wanna take this outside!?! |
| Enheduanna | (reply to micah) posted 2-May-2001 12:18pm You want a piece of me? I'll bust a cap on your ass! |
| micah | (reply to Enheduanna) posted 2-May-2001 1:17pm You better step down before I step up, punk! Don't make me pull my nine on yo sorry white ass! |
| Enheduanna | (reply to micah) posted 2-May-2001 3:03pm Don't make me use my spank-ray! |
| mandy | posted 2-May-2001 7:34pm I am so turned on right now.... |
| micah | (reply to Enheduanna) posted 2-May-2001 10:29pm Your horny Manta Ray? I wouldn't wish that on my worst enemies! |
| Kristal_Rose | (reply to mandy) posted 2-May-2001 10:29pm In a castle high on an underground mountaintop, mandy's staff of flying lab tech monkey's secretly work on perfecting their own 'spank ray'. Will the world be safe? Will Twisty be safe? Will I color my hair violet and turquoise tonight? Set your secret decoder rings and stay tuned for the next episode of 'Gamma Mutants on Oz-9'. |
| mandy | (reply to Kristal_Rose) posted 2-May-2001 10:52pm |
| Enheduanna | (reply to micah) posted 3-May-2001 10:11am No, no, my spank-ray. I keep it in the cupboard right next to the can of whoop-ass. |
| Enheduanna | (reply to mandy) posted 3-May-2001 10:12am Come join in the fun! |
| micah | (reply to Enheduanna) posted 3-May-2001 5:52pm Touch that thing, and I'll have my bat fly in de face! |
| mandy | (reply to Enheduanna) posted 3-May-2001 8:09pm Can I bring my box of "I'm gonna get you sucka!"???? |
| Enheduanna | (reply to micah) posted 3-May-2001 11:02pm Yeah, your bat will rue the day it ever tried to fly within ten yards of my face! |
| Enheduanna | (reply to mandy) posted 3-May-2001 11:04pm Sure! Just make sure you bring a mop to clean up the mess, too. |
| micah | (reply to Enheduanna) posted 4-May-2001 4:55am Yeah?!? What are you planning on doing to my bat? You gonna bat de bat? Bust a cap in de bat? Spank ray de bat? Me bat don't take too kindly to spank ray cap busting. |
| Kristal_Rose | (reply to micah) posted 4-May-2001 5:58am Put on your 3D glasses kids. The (desperately struggling to appear) evil Dr. Nun Quam has released his legions from the Bat-ashmatic replicator. His dark zombie-flesh viper rodents (vat brewed from rye mold, old socks, and nutrasweet) are flying through the night sun skies as we speak {! ! ! Theres one by your face! A SWARM - Look Out ! ! !} Your narrator, the illustrious Captain Devo, unfurls her radiant turquoise-lavendar isis-like attire, watches through the great derigible's periscope, and drones resonant spectral energies played through her thought-scent-organ (available in hamonica form from all fine comicbooks). Fields of sleepy villagers dream to the scents of lotus and poppies while Dr. Nun Quam's cacophony of bats catclysmically have their sonar disrupted. Just then, a masked stranger appears in a glowing saucer. His identity is known only to the Atom Rangers who can use their secret decoder rings to read a secret message printed at the bottom of tubs of popcorn now available in the theater lobby. |
| Kristal_Rose | (reply to mandy) posted 4-May-2001 6:02am Hurry, please bring the monkeys all in business suits. |
| micah | (reply to Kristal_Rose) posted 4-May-2001 7:39am Hmm. |
| Kristal_Rose | posted 4-May-2001 8:11am |
| anonymous | posted 11-May-2001 3:14pm Actually, buddhism is an atheistic religion, not polythiestic. |
| Kristal_Rose | (reply to anonymous) posted 12-May-2001 6:59am Are all your comments anonymous? |
| anonymous | (reply to Kristal_Rose) posted 16-May-2001 6:53pm Yes, I am shy. |
| Kristal_Rose | (reply to anonymous) posted 16-May-2001 7:54pm Fair enough. Wish you weren't. and here at SC that's likely to bring wrath upon you. |
| anonymous | posted 17-May-2001 11:24am Christianity is the only religion based on truth. All other religions have to come up with attractive ideas to get others interested in their religion, since they have no facts to base any beliefs on. |
| Kristal_Rose | (reply to anonymous) posted 18-May-2001 2:49am Christianity emphasizes history, others emphasize metaphorical lore, or 'cause and effect' interpersonal physics that people can become sensitively aware of. Have you spent a year or two as devout practioner of any of these faiths you denounce. If you haven't, you have no more justification to denounce them than a scientist who has never comitted to a spiritual life. Christianity offers salvation and threat of hell. In a sense, a more intense marketing scheme than most other faiths. I think christianity can be a fine gateway to understanding God. It is unfortunate that you make it appear so unappealing. |
| nasale | posted 21-May-2001 9:46pm I've read a little about Buddhism and I like their philosophies on what I read.I don't close my mind to things that are worth looking at. |
| Cleo | posted 9-Jun-2001 3:54pm You guys are so crazy here!! Thanks yall made my day!! |
| Cleo | (reply to anonymous) posted 9-Jun-2001 3:59pm KNOCK,KNOCK,KNOCK,KNOCK!! Hi,can Anonymous come out to play?? Not right now honey,Anonymous is very shy.Maybe some other time o.k.? |
| Enheduanna | (reply to jen) posted 18-Jun-2001 8:35pm Yeah, you never know what wacky initiation rites they're going to be doing! |
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