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single21-Feb-2008politics/religiondilfreak by votes37563.2%

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Is moving towards a simpler government a feasible idea in our complex society?

Thomas Payne in 1776 published a book, "Common Sense". In it he describes the need for independence from Great Britain and also discusses important elements of a worthy government. One element is, "I draw my idea of the form of government from a principle in nature which no art can overturn, viz. that the more simple any thing is, the less liable it is to be disordered, and the easier repaired when disordered;"

Has the government steered away from simplicity? If so, is it feasible to go back to simplicity in the wake of our complex society?



VotesAnswer
10Yes
10No
7Other

UserComment
Enheduanna Survey Central Subscriber
posted 22-Feb-2008 12:43pm  
I suppose it's technically possible, but I think the results would be overwhelmingly bad. I also don't happen to think that small government is better. Well-administered government with good oversight is better, whether that government is large or small. I think larger is better, because I think if the government won't take care of people, no one else will, either.
dilfreak
posted 22-Feb-2008 1:11pm  
I honestly don't know if it's feasible, that's why I made this survey, to see what ya'll thought. The government has definitely steered away from simplicity. I just don't know if it's possible to go back without too much trouble.
dab Survey Central Subscriber Gold Qualifier
posted 22-Feb-2008 1:16pm  
Of course it's feasible. We'd be better off for it too. But we won't.
Galomorro Bronze Star Survey Creator Gold Qualifier This user is on the site NOW (9 minutes ago)
posted 22-Feb-2008 1:29pm  
Yes, I think so.
Melf Gold Qualifier This user is on the site NOW (1 minute ago)
posted 22-Feb-2008 1:40pm  
Yes, if you get the fundamentals of civil rights... right.
bill Survey Central Gold Subscriber Gold Star Survey Creator
posted 22-Feb-2008 2:27pm  
Yes, the government is far far from being simple at this point.
I think it is feasible to simplify it, but it would be a great challenge.

I think simplicity, in general, is usually a good idea, for most things in life.
When something gets too complicated, it usually means you're on the wrong track.
dilfreak
(reply to bill) posted 22-Feb-2008 3:11pm  
Do you think it would be possible to simplify our government without completely starting over from scratch?
LindaH Survey Central Gold Subscriber Gold Star Survey Creator Survey Qualifier
(reply to dilfreak) posted 22-Feb-2008 3:25pm  
I think it would be possible, but it should probably be gradual.
dilfreak
(reply to LindaH) posted 22-Feb-2008 3:27pm  
Yeah it would have to be gradual, I think chaos would ensue if the government were to suddenly make drastic change.
bill Survey Central Gold Subscriber Gold Star Survey Creator
(reply to dilfreak) posted 22-Feb-2008 3:45pm  
Do you mean revolution?  * smile *

What are the forces against this change? It's certainly possible to dismantle most of the government, piece by piece. Departments could get phased out so that it's not too sudden for people to adjust to. People would need to learn to expect less from the government. It's a paradigm shift. But, it doesn't seem impossible to me. It may not be an option in the future, who knows.
LJD
posted 22-Feb-2008 4:08pm  
Would be extremely difficult.....man cannot govern man....only God can.
JessicaWoman99
posted 22-Feb-2008 6:44pm  
Simple whatever that could mean and i hardly doubt it the way everything is going these days
LindaH Survey Central Gold Subscriber Gold Star Survey Creator Survey Qualifier
(reply to LJD) posted 22-Feb-2008 7:29pm  
God doesn't enforce laws on the living.
llamamama Bronze Star Survey Creator
posted 23-Feb-2008 12:20am  
It's Paine.
I totally just wrote an essay about him and John Locke...
I believe an argument of the Constitutional era was that a state as large as ours..would not be able to be governed by a small government. I'm pretty sure Thomas Paine said that..I might be wrong, but I'm pretty sure that that's something my teacher wrote on my essay..
Edit: Why yes, he did say it.
LJD
(reply to LindaH) posted 23-Feb-2008 2:08am  
In other words, only God can govern man justly....because of the nature of man.
LindaH Survey Central Gold Subscriber Gold Star Survey Creator Survey Qualifier
(reply to LJD) posted 23-Feb-2008 2:23am  
I meant, man MUST govern man. God can't put people in jail.
dilfreak
(reply to llamamama) posted 23-Feb-2008 11:41am  
Wow, you're right, it is Paine. I thought it was spelled Payne. Oops. I also just wrote a paper on him, except my report was comparing "Common Sense", "The Declaration of Independence", and "The Constitution" to each other to determine the definition and purpose of governments. Very interesting stuff.
llamamama Bronze Star Survey Creator
(reply to dilfreak) posted 23-Feb-2008 1:24pm  
Yeah, it is really interesting..especially how they all got their ideas from each other..
The paper I just wrote last week was on the Anti-Federalists vs the Federalists
LJD
(reply to LindaH) posted 23-Feb-2008 2:40pm  
I understand what you are saying Linda. When man allows ungodliness, allows worldliness, paganism, will not follow his guide for healthy living, man automatically has chosen human government. Man chose to form his own government over God's government....and see what a big mess the world is in today.
LindaH Survey Central Gold Subscriber Gold Star Survey Creator Survey Qualifier
(reply to LJD) posted 23-Feb-2008 5:02pm  
If we had no government, how would we jail people? The world would be even more messy. Jails wouldn't magically appear. People who don't believe in God can't follow "God's government" "God's Laws" etc. They would be left to run amok. The world is full of individuals, with different beliefs and lifestyles. You say "Man" as if we are all of the same mindset. Our government puts everyone on a universal set of standards. Without that, you'd have people of all different religions, and no religion trying to live by their own set of laws. Weak willed people who lack ethics can't handle that. (Or, more importantly, we wouldn't be able to handle them!) Believers would be living under a different set of laws than non-believers. An entity in the sky (or wherever) can't put his foot down and make everyone behave, and you can't force anyone to believe. Without our government, how would we make criminals behave themselves? You can't even lump all nonbelievers together. Some behave themselves and others don't.
LJD
(reply to LindaH) posted 23-Feb-2008 6:17pm  


In the here and now, you have made some good points. When I say what I say, about God's government....all yours points wouldn't be happening. There would be no murder, no stealing etc....therefore we wouldn't have to have jails...sneaky lawyers, a corrupt system. It is difficult for honest, decent people to live in a world of corruption. Below is what corrupt government does....in order to control, enslave....this is man's government.

FREE CORN

THIS IS TRULY THOUGHT PROVOKING.....

There was a Chemistry professor in a large college
that had some Exchange Students in the class.
One day while the class was in the lab the Prof
noticed one young man (exchange student) who
kept rubbing his back and stretching as if his back hurt.

The professor asked the young man what was the matter.
The student told him he had a bullet lodged in his back.
He had been shot while fighting communists in his native
country who were trying to overthrow his country's
government and install a new communist government.

In the midst of his story he looked at the professor and
asked a strange question.
He asked, ' Do you know how to catch wild pigs?'

The professor thought it was a joke and asked for the
punch line. The young man said this was no joke.
'You catch wild pigs by finding a suitable place
in the woods and putting corn on the ground.
The pigs find it and begin to come
Everyday to eat the free corn.

When they are used to coming every day,
you put a fence down one side of the
place where they are used to coming.

When they get used to the fence,
they begin to eat the corn again and
you put up another side of the fence.
They get used to that and start to eat again.

You continue until you have all four sides of the
fence up with a gate in the last side.

The pigs, who are used to the free corn,
start to come through the gate to eat,
you slam the gate on them and catch the whole herd.

Suddenly the wild pigs have lost their freedom.
They run around and around Inside the fence,
but they are caught.
Soon they go back to eating the free corn.

They are so used to it that they have forgotten
how to forage in the woods for themselves,
so they accept their captivity.

The young man then told the professor that is exactly
what he sees happening to America.
The government keeps pushing us toward
Communism/Socialism and keeps spreading the free corn
out in the form of programs such as supplemental income,

Tax credit for unearned income,
tobacco subsidies,
dairy subsidies,
payments not to plant crops (CRP),
welfare,
medicine,
drugs,
etc.
While we continually lose our freedoms- just a little at a time.

One should always remember
'There is no such thing as a free Lunch!'

Also, 'You can never hire someone to provide a service for you
cheaper than you can do it yourself.



Melf Gold Qualifier This user is on the site NOW (1 minute ago)
(reply to LJD) posted 23-Feb-2008 6:41pm  
'Also, 'You can never hire someone to provide a service for you
cheaper than you can do it yourself. '

Tom Sawyer got away with it  * grin *
RGirl
posted 24-Feb-2008 9:33pm  
Yes it has steered away. At one point simplicity worked but as times change there become loopholes that need to be patched.
LJD
posted 29-Mar-2008 6:29pm  
A small government, less government....more individual responsibility.
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