| User | Comment |
|---|
| hunter | | posted 27-Feb-1998 2:43am |
I don't really do morality...I mean there's nothing I think is WRONG in some "underlying truth" sense...there are a lot of things I think are wrong as in "bad idea" and if I have influence on those things not happening, I try to use it. |
| Jaime | | posted 27-Feb-1998 7:28am |
I checked some, but also the last 3, bcos immoral/unethical it's very culture dependent, and no one can sentence about this, IMHO. |
| vanadium | | posted 27-Feb-1998 10:54am |
At some point I'll have time to sit down and rationally work out my feelings on all of these. You've catalogued a hitlist of 20th Century moral dillemnas.... |
| Dolemite | | posted 27-Feb-1998 3:46pm |
According to Kohlberg's stages of morality, people's moral development can be classified according to how they handle hypothetical moral dilemmas. It's quite interesting. |
| Frizbone | | posted 28-Feb-1998 12:47pm |
The first few I didn't put anything and I expected it to remain that way. Then about halfway, I answered almost all of them. On the bottom it was just like the top. |
bill   |
Ugh, I feel so dirty now. You made me think about all that stuff - and I really struggled with many of them. Some specific comments: "life-saving medical treatment" is often a gray area, many treatments don't always work; is circumcision ritual mutilation? I think it's OK (didn't bother me); I feel bad for the mom, but the diaper store shouldn't be punished; using animals to test "life-saving" medicine is OK; I don't think animals or children understand sex well enough to be allowed to do it with adult humans, some teens do - some don't; industry should not be blamed for small wages, they need to be allowed to be as profitable as possible (given common rules to ensure fairplay and preservation of the environment) or else the capitalist system will not work properly - and I really believe that capitalism allows us to maximize individual freedom (and freedom rocks!). Ayn Rand was right about that - I still wouldn't screw her corpse, but if Atzilut wants to I really don't see the harm in it. I think dead bodies are inanimate objects, they don't have feelings (like animals and humans), so there's no problem screwing them. Good survey elijahblue, I'm so glad I didn't nuke your account. |
| steve |
Other? Obviously, there are things that are not on this list that I consider immoral or unethical. Also, I consider "moral" to be an entirely personal thing, and no one's morality applies to anyone else (although lots of people seem to think that their morality is universal). Ethics, in contrast, in concerned with situations where one's actions affect other people, and is determined socially. (And Ayn Rand can blow me.) Hey, ATZILUT--She was responding to me (responding to you). |
| iwh |
you are generalising to an extraordinary extent in your questions. |
| dab | | posted 7-Mar-1998 10:20pm |
For so many of these, it depends. |
Dahlia  |
That was a good survey. I guess what you would see as unethical would depend on your view of the world. I would like to be able to say that some things are just WRONG no matter what... but it would still be only my humble opinion. |
| Atzilut | | posted 10-Mar-1998 12:23pm |
I retract my previous comments, I didn't read the survey responses completely. I still maintain my stance in favour of Objectivist Ethics. If anyone ACTUALLY CARES to discuss the issue, not take kneejerk, sniping potshots -- then let me know. |
| booker | | posted 10-Mar-1998 5:51pm |
I think a lot of these are distasteful, but not necessarily immoral. And some of them (such as sex between teens and adults) are totally accepted in other cultures as I understand it// Atzilut: sure looks to me like that's what everyone is doing, discussing the issue (now that you've taken out your previous statements). Why don't you elaborate on what you mean by Objective Ethics. |
| cjh | | posted 11-Mar-1998 11:27am |
once again, bad and immoral are ridiculous socially constructed words that have no intrinsic meaning. |
| Timmi | | posted 11-Mar-1998 2:19pm |
As a pretty firm believer in a subjective universe (no one's been able to convince me otherwise, yet) none of these things can be classified as "unethical" or "immoral" without a larger context. |
| calicocat | | posted 11-Mar-1998 8:22pm |
good, thoughtful survey. |
| romkey | | posted 15-Mar-1998 1:24am |
I think that "immoral" and "unethical" are only meaningful in a context, and I'm not sure whose context we're talking about here. I've marked the ones that I'd consider immoral or unethical in my own personal context, but I understand that these actions might be considered moral or ethical in the context of the people involved (ie: not me). If I were considering these in the context of the people involved, I wouldn't check any of them. |
| jefff | | posted 15-Mar-1998 12:54pm |
You can't use "immoral" and "unethical" as equivalents - they're not. "Morals" refers to an internal code of behaviour, "ethics" refer to the standards of the society one is presently discussing (in this case, our own). *Very* different things. For instance, the Unabomber, while unethical, is quite possibly also a morally consistent person. |
| elijahblue | | posted 17-Mar-1998 7:12pm |
steve: 1. the "other" category is for people who don't find their views represented anywhere else on the list I created. 2. One's actions always affect other people. 3. Ayn Rand is deceased, so I guess you don't have a problem with necrophilia...  ***Bill: do you really think developed countries farming out factory jobs to third world countries where they use children and pay barely subsistence wages for 14 hour work days "maximizes individual freedom"? ***Atzilut: just in case you don't get it yet, steve said "Ayn Rand can blow me." If that really happened it would be necrophilia. It was just a stupid little joke, not even addressed to you. ***seth: many of them do not "agree to trade." Children still make up a large percentage of labor in developing countries. Large numbers of people are lied to, brought to Saipan (or other US territories) from China under false pretenses, and find themselves locked into factories to attempt to pay off their fare from China. And as for the "their life is better" argument: only in the way that a political prisoner who cooperates with their jailer will receive better treatment. That does not make what the jailer is doing right. |
| gilly | | posted 17-Mar-1998 10:43pm |
I don't think there's one set of morals or ethics; any of these could fit into someone's system of morals and ethics. As to whether they fit into my own, well, that's a different story. |
| joe | | posted 18-Mar-1998 12:57am |
it was easy for me. i know where i stand on all these issues (i said 8 were immoral) |
| Twanger | | posted 19-Mar-1998 12:23am |
Good survey! I didnt put teen adult, but that depends on the age of the teen and the age of the adult. Technically, myself, being 18 am an adult and my girlfriend, being 17 is a "teen" so, it's a judgement call. ***Bill and seth: I'm guessing you've never read The Grapes of Wrath. If you haven't I would definately recomend looking into it for ideas on your subject of debate here. (go elija!) |
| Pigeon |
To think that all of these are goingon right now is sad |
| seth | | posted 20-Apr-1998 7:12pm |
elijahblue: If their lives are not made better by working the hours they do for the wages they do, why do they do it? Assuming they're not slaves, they've each decided their lives are improved by their current arrangement. Why is it ever unethical for two people to agree to trade? (Yes, I've read _The Grapes of Wrath_.) |
| reality | | posted 15-May-1998 5:12pm |
some of the options I consider disgusting, but not immoral or unethical. Also, my morals are very situationally modified. (if it matters, the ones I chose were the adoptive ones and industry) |
| kadai | | posted 15-May-1998 6:39pm |
Those terms are subjective, based on the society whose mores you've adapted. Personally I think lots of things on the list are gross, hurtful, and unfair. I don't always equate that with immoral or unethical. |
| phi | | posted 23-May-1998 11:40pm |
I'd love to see cross-correlation on these! |
| BadtzMaru | | posted 30-May-1998 5:11am |
Excellent, excellent survey! Brah-voh! |
| dpolicar |
The "culturally important ritual mutilation" choice is odd... do ear-piercings count? The question seems to imply that natives of industrialized countries don't indulge in this sort of thing, which is patently false... Intriguingly, the only one of these I checked was the first one (refusing treatment for your child). Many of the others make me queasy or I feel are indefensible, but I don't see them as particularly moral questions. |
