User	Comment
eris	posted 12-Aug-1999 9:55pm   A little more explanation here: The current power hierarchy of doctors and nurses got set up largely in the late 19th century, when the doctors (predominantly male) did some political-type manipulations to keep themselves in a dominant position over the nurses (predominantly female). The distinction between them was far less clear before that time, as surgery was not (to a large degree) a viable treatment before the development of aseptic technique, and modern pharmaceutical technology was also in its infancy. Because of this, and other related political events in the early 20th century that had an effect on healthcare (e.g. advent of narcotics laws), many forms of healthcare are less available in our current system (e.g. insurance doesn't usually pay for chiropractic care). Training is different both qualitatively and quantitatively across the healthcare subdisciplines, resulting in economic constraints on the types of care particular individuals can give (doctors have to do something that pays well), and also in an uneven (and possibly undesirable) distribution of skills (e.g. doctors are sometimes poor listeners or treat patients in an arrogant or patronizing way). So, could we do better?
Jasmine	posted 13-Aug-1999 12:19am   My last fully professional occupation was writing software to manage HMO's, PPO's, & Work-comp claims. I was aghast at the philosophy of the owner. She said, "There is always one most efficient treatment of a patient; any Doctor who considers the practice an 'art' deserves a malpractice suit." She didn't believe in people taking time off work for medical reasons. I know that i for one, have always defied doctors knowledge; 3 of them couldn't find an explanation for how i was growing breasts by an act of will. I underwent hormone tests and such. I was hoping this question would address our conception of the human body. Eastern medicine gives the body far more credit for it's regenerational abilities, the power of Chi etc. I don't know anything about comparative management structures. i do know i have been disappointed by the limited scope of integration, and the un-encompassing technical stance adopted by some specialists. But then i am a craftsman/engineer and don't appreciate technician outlooks in general.
mandy	posted 13-Aug-1999 12:55am   I would like to see the focus shift towards more preventative measures than curative ones. Educate people early on about how their bodies run and how lifestyle choices(smoking,lack of exercise, poor diet etc..) are connected with health later in life. Nutrition should be focused on more because I feel a lot of illness stems from bad eating choices. Also the mind/body connection should be focused on more as well. I would like to see traditional and non-traditional medicine merge into one giant cooperative globule of goodness and caring that supports and nurtures us from birth through death with information, education and awareness. But then, I'd like it if they brought back Charlie's Angels too.
Jody	posted 13-Aug-1999 10:01am   I believe western medicine saves many lives, but using eastern-style medicine as an adjutant therapy could, in many cases, enhance life, increase survival, and provide comfort through unavoidable suffering of the ill.
bill	posted 13-Aug-1999 1:54pm   I like the idea. But I also don't think it directly addresses some of the main problems with the western health care system. Namely: treating the whole patient, not just physical ailments but also the emotional effects (integrate what we call counseling in with care); reduce the emphasis on drugs and surgery (our doctors are trained to use these tools, but they are used too much, they should be trained to use other less invasive tools); health care insurance reform (I would even consider elimination of health care insurance).
mandy	posted 13-Aug-1999 2:40pm   bill...I have no health insurance anyway. How would eliminating health care insurance altogether be an improvement? I'm curious....
fooyun	posted 13-Aug-1999 3:30pm   Society has to change its thinking first before it can improve its quality of life.
Jasmine	posted 13-Aug-1999 5:21pm   As i've said before. There is no reason someone working in fast-food deserves any less health care than the richest professional. I'm somewhat of a communist in a C.S. Lewis fashion, though I believe computer job placement could do it an such a way as to best cultivate our individual talents and desires.
SueBee	posted 13-Aug-1999 6:34pm   We definitely need some changes, but I'm not sure exactly what you're talking about here. I went to the link in the explanation and it's about abortion. (??)
eris	posted 13-Aug-1999 8:58pm   SB: It's the historical part about 3 paragraphs in that is relevant. About how doctors pushed for abortion to be illegal to consolidate power from midwives...
Jasmine	posted 14-Aug-1999 1:34am   How should i know?
bigkim65	posted 14-Aug-1999 3:00am   I also think we'd benefit if the guidelines were more open to other forms of treatment and healing; like using herbal remedies, using meditation, or even prayer.
Jasmine	posted 14-Aug-1999 3:05am   that's all for sure.
bill	posted 14-Aug-1999 8:35am   I feel that insurance hides costs and messes up the medical care market. There are too many things that appear to be cheap to insured people, that are in fact rather expensive. If people paid out of their own pocket, there would be a greater emphasis on providing medical care at reasonable costs. I think Walmarts of medicine would pop-up, and lower income people (people who are often uninsured now) would be more able to afford medical care. ...and, on the other end we'd still have sophisticated and expensive procedures being done on the rich. Also, I think doctors would be more directly motivated be patients desires for service and lower costs. Also, insurance is a middle-man - eliminating them should save some money as well. Also insurance sometimes causes us to get stuck with certain providers. We're not able to "vote with our feet", by changing care providers when we're not happy. I recognize, that there would likely be a bad effect of this in that most people would avoid doctors even more if office visits costed more than $10. So, we'd likely suffer in the preventative care area. I don't think this has to be the case, but people will have to decide on their own that preventative care will help them in the long run. I think deciding to get checked medically should be on par with deciding to exercise on a regular basis.
drdt	posted 14-Aug-1999 10:48am   bill: in other words, only the leisurely rich would bother to do it?
mandy	posted 14-Aug-1999 2:31pm   I live that way now, bill. I have no insurance and I wish medical costs were lower since I must pay everything out of my own pocket on my income as a working mom. But, most places allow you to make payments and do not charge any interest...so I am plugging away to dig myself out of an $800 dental bill @ $40 a month. Luckily I haven't been ill. I recently just finished paying off a bill from the clinic where I was diagnosed and counseled for my diabetes. That was 5 years ago. I payed it off $20 a month. I try to take very good care of myself so I do not need medical care. My daughter has insurance through her daddy(Teamsters). The bills go directly to him and he pays 20%, I believe. We discussed National Health Care(like Britain and Canada) in other surveys. Would that be better for us here in the States? I don't know. I worry about the quality of health care and having to wait. I like being able to go in any time and be cared for if needed. Britain provides some great prenatal and postnatal services for moms. They have a visiting nurse that comes to your home and helps you learn to care properly for your newborn. And doctors still make housecalls!
bill	posted 14-Aug-1999 9:38pm   The money to pay your daughters medical bills comes from the Teamsters who in turn deduct it (directly or indirectly as a benefit) from your x-husband's pay. I'd prefer that your x get all his pay in cash including what the Teamsters pay in medical insurance for him. I bet he'd be richer for it. I don't think we should do away with Medicare/Medcaid (government help for people in need of medical care).
mandy	posted 14-Aug-1999 9:42pm   I think my X would prefer that too :)
they	posted 15-Aug-1999 1:58am   mandy.. Medicaid offers the home nurse also.
Jasmine	posted 15-Aug-1999 2:32am   Life is starting to sound sensible again.
daver	posted 15-Aug-1999 8:46am   **bill: There are other things twisting the market: employers can deduct the cost of the portion of health insurance that they subsidize while employees (including those who are self-employed) can't. In effect, this makes insurance cheaper for employers than anyone else (leaving out the fact that they undoubtedly get a better deal by buying in bulk). As a result, the only competitive place to buy insurance is your employer who probably only offers one or maybe two plans. There's no opportunity to "vote with your feet" and get better insurance elsewhere. If everyone (or no one) could deduct the cost, insurance would no longer be tied to employment.
bill	posted 16-Aug-1999 11:35am   I'd vote for that change.

 
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