If the United States or an ally ever caught Osama bin Ladin, do you think they'd publicize it?

That's how terrorists work. That's how they win. We can't live in fear of them. If we catch Osama, then put his head on a stick. Better yet - do what they do - chop his head off with a dull knife on TV. And the next guy that steps up and kills innocent people, do the same thing. Living in fear of terrorism is not going to stop it. The only way it can be stopped is with force - and showing no fear. Because fear is what they want us to have.

There's too much to gain from publicizing it. If Bush were to pull it off, I think he'd easily win the election. The American people would see it as a great victory, to have caught the man responsible for 9/11.

I think terrorist stuff like the revenge killings thing is going to happen regardless... How many children were just killed in Russia? How many hostage heads have been cut off in Iraq? One doesn't get the impression that there's much they can do to make matters worse.

Sometimes I wonder whether if Osama Bin Laden didn't exist it would be necessary to invent him. Despite the obvious threat, the USA needs its own 'Emmanuel Goldstein' to galvanise support amongst the electorate.
If he was ever caught, the announcement would only be made at a convenient time, like say.. oooo.. the end of October.

I think most politicians would think it was worth the risk, honestly. Mostly in terms of re-election.

I think it's a very real possibility. Especially when Bush said he wasn't necessarily concerned about Osama himself. That may have been a clue that we've already caught him..

Then again, it could mean Bush is more concerned about getting anyone responsible for terrorist killings, including Osama.

Just thinking out loud.

Would they what!

Yes, especially if Bush stays president. He'd just want to show everyone that he did something he said he was going to do, even if it's stupid to tell.

Just to clarify though, I think Kerry would tell too.

it makes me wonder...what happened to saddam?

I'm sure they would make the biggest deal of it that they could.

If Bush takes a large enough dip in the polls, the glass case they're keeping Osama in will be broken "in case of emergency."

Yes, they would let everyone know.

I doubt they would be able to keep it a secret, even if they wanted to. You think no one would notice? "Hey, the boss is gone!", "Ah, he probably popped out for a pack of smokes..."

Boink!

He's waiting to go on trial right now in Iraq. Not much on the news about it though. It's a "secret trial". No spectators. No media...

Absolutely. Politicians only care about their image and ego, not if Osama's followers will take revenge.
They would even pose next to his corpse to get votes.

Yes, so by whom he's going to be judged? Iraqis? Americans? Both? An international jury?

Supposedly an Iraqi judge, but as I said, it's a secret. Anything could happen.

It is all about looking good, Like when they caught Saddam... I think it would be the same way...

I wonder...it shouldn't be a secret.

this way they can do anything they want to, even hide him somewhere and use him whenever is suitable.

yes, more than likely, especially if they have done it now right before the election. There might be a delay in the information, but I am pretty sure that if we caputed him, the word would get out to the muslim world. Like I am so sure they would notice that only their most beloved chief is suddenly missing.

only torture wont work

keep in mind here we're dealing with people capable of strapping bombs on themselves. I seriously doubt that death scares them, and we wont get a chance to torture them because they're allready dead.

btw: I do agree, we should show any fear and continue doing as usual. (this includes ingoring those stupid color alerts)

Yeah - they would but more than likely it would be at an opportune time....like to co-incide with something else going on politically, I bet. And besides...just because we caught him - does not mean that in any way - we would ever allow him to make himself a martyr! Don't you think?!
Perhaps it would be a good idea to put these guys in padded cells like the mental cases that they are, so that they can't hurt themselves or anyone else for that matter. That might just be enough to torture them humanely, considering what it is that they want!!!

Well his testimony is liable to contain "classified information". In other words, facts which would embarrass the occupation forces.

I see!

After all, we can't have their complicity put on public record!

sure they can't!

I think that they'd let everyone know - they would feel it was vindication for going to war everywhere.

> Sometimes I wonder whether if Osama Bin Laden
> didn't exist it would be necessary to invent him.
And what proof do you have that Osama Bin Laden was not an invention in itself?

Good question! Although I would say that if you were going to invent a bogey man to scare people into voting for you, you'd have to be a real moron to pick someone belonging to a family with close ties to your family.

But obviously Bush isn't that... ummm.. oh .

No, definitely not.

So, how's the state of the affaire in the UK? I hear that Tony Blaid wants to be a PM for another term.

In the UK, all the major parties have just finished their party conferences. The highlights of the Labour conference were Tony Blair apologising for the WMD intelligence being wrong (but not apologising for removing Saddam), Bono from U2 making an impassioned speech about third world debt and an ordinary Iraqi woman telling the delegates (with tears in her eyes) how Blair had "stood up to Saddam and freed my people" and who later turned out to have links to the CIA and a husband who is a minister in the interim government.
The Tory party conference on the other hand was quite laughable, with leader Michael Howard trying to appear almost human. He talked emotionally about how he loved Britain, how Britain had saved his life when he came here during WWII as a child and how his grandmother was one of the millions killed in the Nazi concentration camps. He then went on to explain how one of his first priorities as Prime Minister would be to clamp down on immigration.
In attempt to further soften their image, they'd even commissioned a short film to be shown that showed senior members talking about their first kiss, or the last CD they'd bought. Michael Howard's last purchase was apparently Meatloaf and 'Bat out of Hell' seems somewhat appropriate for a man that a lot of people think of as being a bit vampiric. Even fellow colleague Anne Widdecombe once said that there was "something of the night about him".

In the good old days, there were 3 parties. The Conservatives occupied the right wing, Labour occupied the left and the Liberal Democrats sat in the middle vying for scraps. The Tories used to take pride in having "clear blue water" between themselves and their main rivals.
Now, 'New' Labour have moved to the right and occupy the centre ground, directly challenging the Tories in certain policy areas. The Lib Dems have moved to the left to fill the void left by Labour and we now have UKIP.
UKIP (the UK Independence Party) is a relatively new right wing party that have a broad range of policies which include pulling out of the EU, not being in the EU anymore and ..er.. that's it. One of it's leading figures is Robert Kilroy Silk who used to be a Labour MP, and then was a chat show host before getting sacked by the BBC for making disparaging comments about Arabs in a newspaper and decided to go back into politics again.
Think of them as our answer to Ralph Nader. They're never going to win much, but they'll take votes away from the Tories, so much so that in a recent by-election in Hartlepool, the Tories finished 4th.

Back in 1994 after the death of Labour leader John Smith, the two golden boys of the Labour Party were Gordon Brown and Tony Blair and it was clear that one of them would definitely become the new leader of the party. The question was, which one. The problem the Labour Party had at the time was that it was deemed to be unelectable, stuffy and incompetent. The memories of militant unionists, strikes, power cuts and 3 day weeks were too fresh in the mind. According to legend the two met for dinner in a restaurant in Islington, London to agree on what is now referred to as 'The Deal'. As far as anyone knows, it went something along the lines of Blair convincing Brown that the most important thing was to get Labour elected into government, and that since he was the prettier, younger man he'd have a better chance of achieving this. He would serve as PM for a certain amount of time and then step down and Brown could take over.

Blair has recently had a minor operation to sort out an irregular heartbeat. It's not the first time he's had a flutter in that area and senior figures in the Labour party were worried that this could be seen as a weakness to be exploited by the Tories. But Blair has stated that if Labour win the next general election in 2005 (they will), he will serve a full 3rd term in office before definitely stepping down as PM at the end of it. At this point, Gordon Brown will most likely take over as leader of the party and 'The Deal' will have been completed.

(well.. you did ask )

Kilroy was a *Labour* MP?

http://news.bbc.co.uk/media/images/39514000/jpg/_3... - freaky

The Tory party conference on the other hand was quite laughable, with leader Michael Howard trying to appear almost human. He talked emotionally about how he loved Britain, how Britain had saved his life when he came here during WWII as a child and how his grandmother was one of the millions killed in the Nazi concentration camps. He then went on to explain how one of his first priorities as Prime Minister would be to clamp down on immigration.
LOL

Don't worry, I enjoyed reading this. I knew most of those facts already, but in dry fashion without knowing the background gossip. I wouldn't mind if you went on forever talking about politics. I concern myself with politics of three cocuntries: Canada ('tis relevant, but it's fudging boring), the States (I want to puke everytime I hear the names Bush or Kerry), and the UK (very fun and funny).

Yes. In the mid 70s to early 80s. He was the MP for Knowsley near Liverpool (about as safe as Labour seats get), but left because he didn't like the emerging militancy (Derek Hatton et al).

I've never been a fan - watching his talkshow used to make me cringe so much but it was necessary off-school-sick TV - like This Morning.

I have a theory that daytime television is deliberately awful as a means of keeping the unemployment figures down .

Ah, but often the old films they put on are great. I had a 3 month stint of being mostly off school - I watched a lot of great old films that no-one has ever heard of!

If you have any specific or general questions about UK politics.. just let me know. I'm a bit of a jack of all trades if truth be told, but I know my politics!

Oh, just talk about it. Tell me what people think of all of this.

Think about all what? Bin Laden, the election, or more British subjects?

There's a few topics about British politics and society that could easily set me off on one long rant if you'd be interested in reading it.

Let's see...
Back to Basics
"Crisis? What Crisis?"
Jeremy Thorpe and Rinka

I'd love to hear about 'Crisis? What Crisis?' Oh, and I'd love to hear more about Tony Blair. Although I am currently pissed about him, I still adore him.